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elmwood
08-03-2003, 05:19 PM
No, I'm not talking about those of a Confederate cultural orientation in the UK or Australia. I'm wondering what the equivalent of American rednecks are in other countries. Is there a blue collar subculture in ... oh, Germany, that is generally looked down upon by the middle class? As in the US, are they obsessed with stock car racing, hunting, fishing, mullets and Wal-Mart? What about other traits?

Chefguy
08-03-2003, 05:23 PM
Don't know about rednecks, but Germans are extremely fond of country music for some reason.

Really Not All That Bright
08-03-2003, 06:09 PM
I'm pretty sure there aren't any overseas walmarts...

RickJay
08-03-2003, 06:12 PM
Yeah, there's certainly a subculture in Canada, though of course in some respects it's quite similar. Country music, 80's hairstyles, cheap applique sweatshirts with dolphins and wolves, you even see an El Camino now and then. Mostly in small towns. It's sort of similar to what you'd see in Minnesota; instead of NASCAR, it's snowmobile racing. Stuff like that.

If you want to find an equivalent subculture in England, I bet you'd find it at a soccer riot.

Mops
08-03-2003, 06:16 PM
Cannot assemble a complete redneck, but I can offer some disparate German parts. They are not usually combined in the same person, though.

- young men who like to drive fast cars but cannot afford a real sports car. I imagine they are also the stock-car audience demographic. Stereotypical girlfriend's job is hairdresser, so that's the mullets taken care of also.

- others who drive all-terrain vehicles and pickup trucks (usually in the city)

- rural yokels (who usually are not much more into the outdoors than city people are). In the more remote villages they can be pretty conservative of outlook and incomprehensible of speech. Leisure activities, for those above the age of hanging out at the bus shelter and driving to the disco on weekend nights, tends much to involve local associations like fire brigade, shooting club, soccer club, fools' club (Swabia/Baden)/carnival club (Rhineland), choir, etc.

- country-music fans

- Wal-Mart seems not to have gained much ground her, but there are hardcore fans of the Aldi chain (go to groups.google.com and look for the newsgroup de.alt.fan.aldi). For some reason they call the cashiers "priestesses".


Fishing is more of a middle-class hobby. Hunting is middle middle class and above because of initial investment and ongoing cost (you need to take a demanding exam and then you must lease the hunting rights to a piece of forest, with associated duties such as keeping down the numbers of deer, shooting animals wounded in traffic accidents, etc)

ruadh
08-03-2003, 06:16 PM
There isn't really a direct equivalent to "redneck" in Ireland. Probably the closest would be "culchie", which has the same connotations of backwardness, thickness, etc. But it's a geographical rather than a class term - it refers to any Irish person from outside of Dublin.

Rabid_Squirrel
08-03-2003, 06:18 PM
Well, there's West Auckland (http://rinkworks.com/rinkforum/messages/8088.shtml) for all of your kiwi rednecking needs. Unfortunately it's cleaned itself up a bit nowadays.

Harriet the Spry
08-03-2003, 06:54 PM
I believe in Spain the term used was "hortero," which had some connotation to working in an orchard, but also the redneck connotation of a hick with no taste.

I am 99% sure there are overseas Wal-Marts. I remember reading an article about difficulties Wal-Mart had adapting to the German market. Things like shoppers not wanted the cashiers to bag their purchases.

Tuckerfan
08-03-2003, 07:15 PM
I used to tease my ex-girlfriend who grew up in Vietnam about eating cats and dogs and the response she would give me didn't use the term redneck, but from the description of the kind of person who would eat cats and dogs, I'd say that Vietnam had 'em as well.

Chefguy
08-03-2003, 07:52 PM
Brazilians have the "Nordestinos", or Northeasterners, whom everyone in Brazil assumes are like folks from Cracker Holler.

mcbiggins
08-03-2003, 10:25 PM
I had a long rant written out, butthe interweb ate it. This may be a good thing.

Ontario has rednecks. Many are like Bob and Doug Mackenzie. They are called hosers. But more and more are being influenced by southern redneck culture. The are into NASCAR and pickup trucks and the guys have mullets and the girls have bad ealry-80's perms straight out of "Rock'n'Roll Parking Lot." But they are also into confederate flags, and some sport really bad fake southern accents. I grew up in the south. Those last two items really piss me off. Billy Ray Cyrus wannabes are scary.

Askance
08-03-2003, 10:42 PM
Here in Sydney Australia they're called Westies (Western suburbs), Townies (Bankstown, one of the western suburbs), or Hoons (any idiot in an overpowered car). But these are more your suburban white trash stereotypes, there isn't really a rural equivalent - we don't really have a hillbilly district, for instance.

Rabid_Squirrel
08-03-2003, 11:11 PM
Addendum:

In NZ/Aust, Bogans are similar to Hoons. Might be some subtle differences I'm not appreciating though.

Minor hilarity with confused young townies confusing it with Bouganville in PNG.

ruadh
08-04-2003, 03:27 AM
Also, you know, we have urban white trash to a much greater extent than the U.S. (where the bad neighbourhoods in cities tend to be mostly black or Hispanic). In Scotland these folks, specifically the young ones, are called "neds" (short for "non-educated delinquent"). These kids' fashion accessories are tracksuits, tacky gold jewellery, and prams.

We have them in Ireland, too, of course. We just don't have as catchy a name for them.

ooga booga
08-04-2003, 03:32 AM
Originally posted by Harriet the Spry
I am 99% sure there are overseas Wal-Marts.
I'll try not to hijack this thread any more than to say that this is true. I have been to a Wal-Mart (a Super Wal-Mart, at that) in Kunming, China. As if that wasn't a sufficiently mind-blowing experience, the city was also home to a Sam's Club, which I unfortunately didn't get a chance to visit - I was quite curious whether my US membership card would work. If Wal-Mart can get a toehold in China, of all places, I'm sure they've opened stores elsewhere too.

One And Only Wanderers
08-04-2003, 05:40 AM
Originally posted by dutchboy208
I'm pretty sure there aren't any overseas walmarts...

They've taken over ASDA here in the UK, and the store is now known as ASDA*WALMART

Shrinking Violet
08-04-2003, 06:25 AM
I think the closest we have in the UK is White Van Man, who is usually married to Essex Girl. ;)

(I can say this 'cos I was born on the Essex border ....)

Julie

Lobelia Overhill
08-04-2003, 06:35 AM
Originally posted by ruadh
There isn't really a direct equivalent to "redneck" in Ireland. Probably the closest would be "culchie", which has the same connotations of backwardness, thickness, etc. But it's a geographical rather than a class term - it refers to any Irish person from outside of Dublin.


Well speaking as a culchie [ye bleedin' Dubliner], it's the other way round, us refined types outside of the city look down our noses at the ruffians who live in the city :D

Wolfian
08-04-2003, 07:22 AM
Originally posted by RickJay
Yeah, there's certainly a subculture in Canada, though of course in some respects it's quite similar. Country music, 80's hairstyles, cheap applique sweatshirts with dolphins and wolves, you even see an El Camino now and then.

In my work for a blood-thirsty cult I depend on my El Camino.

elmwood
08-04-2003, 07:25 AM
Originally posted by Rabid_Squirrel
Well, there's West Auckland (http://rinkworks.com/rinkforum/messages/8088.shtml) for all of your kiwi rednecking needs. Unfortunately it's cleaned itself up a bit nowadays.

Sounds like a clone of the River Rats you'll find in Buffalo, New York. River Rats, who live in the Riverside and Black Rock neighborhoods, are known as being "groders" or "heshers" -- stoned out motorheads -- who are culturally trapped in the 1980s. A diploma from one of the city vocational high schools (usually Burgard or Seneca), demin jackets, ripped or black jeans, black heavy metal concert t-shirts, work boots, long scruffy hair, fanaticism for 1980s era metal bands, and driving a large, 1970s era American car with at least one body part painted in exposed primer. The female of the species looks and acts similar, and is coiffed with feathered, dyed blonde hair. Marlboros, of course.


You may be from Riverside if --
-------------------------------

1) You consider abandoned grain mills and factories as places of worship.

2) Your car has at least two body panels that are painted in grey primer.

3) Your house smells like feet and "oregeno."

4) You consider "Fuckin' a!" to be a complete, gramatically correct sentence.

5) You ever lived within walking distance of at least three adult book stores.

6) You own more than five bongs.

7) "Glass pack muffler" is a regular part of your vocabulary.

8) The most prized item in your wardrobe is a Quiet Riot concert t-shirt.

9) You know the current market price for "an ounce."

10) You hear someone talking about "nickels" and "dimes," and you know thay aren't talking about pocket change.

11) You still consider feathered hair and the mullet to be up-to-date styles.

12) You don't have a cellular phone, but you have at least three CB radios, one of which is illegally modified for "extras."

13) All the buttons of your car stereo are set to "97 Fuckin' Rock, man!"

14) You ever spray-painted your significant other's name on a railroad bridge.

15) You ever spray-painted "Slayer" on a railroad bridge.


Buffalo has few rednecks of the Confederate sort. Folks living in rural areas outside of Buffalo tend to resemble the urban middle class, only they're a bit more into the huntin' and fishin' scene. More flannel, but that's about the only major difference.

Insecta
08-04-2003, 07:32 AM
Many people in the south of England, particularly in London, regard Northerners as sub human. A Northerner is anyone in between the Watford Gap service station on the M1 and the Scottish border. For reference, someone from Birmingham is a Brommy, someone from Liverpool is a Scouser and someone from Manchester is a Mancurian. These are not terms of endearment. If anything, a Northerner is the closest English equivalent of a Redneck, because to some extent, it also symbolizes a north south divide. That said, here are some other similar regional perceptions:

Although I can’t speak so much from experience, Northerners often regard Southerners as snobbish. Cannot imagine why.

Football ‘ooligans are not held in high regard by anyone, themselves excluded.

Essex and its inhabitants are commonly regarded as the worse place in the South, embodying all that is bad about England. The Essex stereotype is ignorant, tracksuit wearing (preferably with white stripes down trouser legs), gold chain sporting and heavy accent possesing.

In southern England, various cities, usually those heavily developed in the sixties, may be used as starting points when discussing how bad something is. Popular favourites include Milton Keynes, Slough, Swindon, Convetry and Hemel Hempstead.

Cornwall and Devon (counties) are suspected to be backwards, poor since they only appear on T.V. in connection with clotted cream or some dubious architectural project. That said, its no problem for half the South to go there for their holidays.

English people generally imagine Wales to be one big coal mine with very depressing weather. Ireland is where the IRA come from, Northern Ireland is a permanent source of bother and Scotland is just too far North to think about.

Most people on television speak with what is known as received pronunciation (also know as BBC English because the BBC do this the most prominently). This is the posh stereotyped British accent. However, apart from some areas of London and the Home Counties (counties that surround London, giant ring of suburbs) and a few other regions, this accent is not in the majority. A throwback to Victorian pompousness? You judge…

Iteki
08-04-2003, 08:13 AM
Originally posted by ruadh
<snip>These kids' fashion accessories are tracksuits, tacky gold jewellery, and prams.

We have them in Ireland, too, of course. We just don't have as catchy a name for them.

Noone uses the word skanger any more?
A friend coined the word "snax" as a synonym for skangers due to a neon sign in The Harp bar (at O'Connel bridge) saying "Snax available all day".


Anyhoo, Sweden being the most americanised country in the multiverse they not only have an equivelant to rednecks, they have actual rednecks! This is a subculture called "raggare" who worship the rural american 50's. teddyboys.nu is a site belonging to one of the "raggare clubs". Where I live in rural Sweden they drive into town on a saturday night and drive around the town square playing 50's music from their cars. Some of the cars are really beautiful, customised hot-rods etc. others are complete beaters, but bíg and old. I work with a guy who restores raggare cars and has a ducks-ass hairdo.

We just had the local summer fair, and the amount of tat on sale with confederate flags on it had to be seen to be belived.

FTR, a huge hobby amongst non-raggare rural kids is souping up completely normal cars. This again is something that has to be seen to be believed, for example an 87 Volvo with full spoilers, double exhausts, turbo thingy on the hood and tinted windows.

ruadh
08-04-2003, 08:20 AM
Oh, yeah, you do hear "skanger".

ruadh
08-04-2003, 08:21 AM
(hit submit too soon)

... but The Harp is long gone!

Tomcat
08-04-2003, 08:31 AM
South Africans have the term Redneck (rooinek(I think?)) but it is slang for a British person (sorta like our 'redcoats' from days of ol'). But they most certainly have the type of Redneck that you mean. Rural Afrikaans people have a lot in common with your average American redneck. Big trucks, farms, guns and racism - Gotta love 'em.

I would then go onto say that of all the cultures I have experienced, the closest one to the US have been white South Africans as a whole. Everytime I go there I'd swear I was in one of the southern States except for the language. Eating at a Saddles restaurant is like a space/time continuum warp to Western Sizzlin' back home in Colorado. Same food, same atmosphere, same mom yelling at her 6 kids to stop running around the restaurant and spitting in the salad bar...

-Tcat

-Tcat

bayonet1976
08-04-2003, 09:07 AM
Sure, in the Cuban culture we have "cubanazos", or ultra-Cubans. These are the guys who wear all the gold chains, gold bracelets, white shoes, and thick white belts. They are also a caricature of all the latin male stereotypes you can think of, and typically speak with a thick Havana accent. That's right, Cuban rednecks are city dwellers.

Mort Furd
08-04-2003, 10:12 AM
Hmmm. Tschild seems to be a real German, and I'd not like to contradict him, but without strain I can tell you where to find four Wal-Marts within an hours drive of my home.

Wal Mart didn't so much move in as it took over an existing chain. All of the "Wertkauf" stores turned into Wal Marts. Maybe they didn't have many "Wertkaufs" in Tschild's part of Germany.

They've got rednecks here, too. You'll find lots of truck drivers who are into American country music - and the horrid stuff that some German "artists" have produced along those lines. For some reason, these guys also have Confederate flags - either as American style license plates behind the windshield or as a real flag hanging in the back of the cab. I've even seen one guy who had a confederate flag hung up on a flag pole in his garden.

The guys who like fast cars but can't afford the real thing drive Opel Mantas. Imagine a not especially whoopy Chevy Nova, and you know what a Manta is. These are the guys who tramp around in Italian made cowboy boots (with the cockroach zapper toes and silver fittings) and whose girlfriends are usually hairdressers with (fake) blond hair.

The guys do wear mullets, and their cars sometimes have five-point seat belts in them like a real racecar - they need the safety belt becuase they are such poor drivers, not because their cars are so fast.

In refinement not often seen in the US, these folks often put their names (or nick-names) on the driver's side door with stick on letters. You may also find the name stamped into a license plate lying behind the front windshield in front of the steering wheel. If the girlfriend is capable of more than cutting hair and f...ing, then you may also see the names embroidered into the seat covers. The girlfriend's name will often be found somewhere on the passenger side - done in the same style as the guy's name naturally.

With the more stringent German laws, you won't often see one with a weed grown yard full of dead cars, but it does happen. Hell, I know where to find a guy who lives in an old gas station, and has a couple of dead cars and a rusty old bus converted to a billboard parked in the weed grown (concrete) parking lot.

Because of the minimum drivers license age of 18 - and the expensive schooling that goes with it - young rednecks concentrate on hot-rodding their mopeds instead of working on cars. They've gotten it down to such a science that I've seen kids pulled over on the highway with the cops writing them a ticket for speeding and a second ticket for having modified the moped so far from its registered specs. A moped with a 50cc motor and brakes and other parts made for a top speed of 30km/h is a frightening thing to behold at 70km/h. One of these clowns even passed me one day. I was driving along at about 60km/h because the road was kind of curvy. This yo-yo came blasting past (downhill with a tail wind) and passed me. I laughed so hard, I forgot to call the cops. The guy was wearing a long black leather trench coat and a black full-face helmet with a tinted shield on it. Think Keanu Reeves in "The Matrix" on a moped. Funnier than hell.

CB radios are also common amongst the truck driving redneck types - not that they know anything about radio. I'm minded of one fellow who had a great huge CB antenna plopped on top of his (ragged out) old Manta. That might have been okay, but he had rain soaked toy bunny rabbit spitted on the thing - which does your antenna matching absolutely nothing good on a rainy day.

Redneck types abound, and I think you'll find them in any culture.

lost4life
08-04-2003, 12:39 PM
Originally posted by Chefguy
Brazilians have the "Nordestinos", or Northeasterners, whom everyone in Brazil assumes are like folks from Cracker Holler.

*sigh* My wife's family comes from Cracker Bottom. It's like a holler, but not quite as upscale.

Dogface
08-04-2003, 01:32 PM
Originally posted by ruadh
There isn't really a direct equivalent to "redneck" in Ireland. Probably the closest would be "culchie", which has the same connotations of backwardness, thickness, etc. But it's a geographical rather than a class term - it refers to any Irish person from outside of Dublin.


Ah, so that's why the Irish graduate student I worked with used "Shite-town" as a synonym for "Dublin".

raygirvan
08-04-2003, 06:55 PM
As to the UK, our brand of redneck tends mostly to come from suburban council - or ex-council - estates. Fairly recognisable type: close-cropped hair to hide incipient pattern baldness, tattoos with naff designs, big dog, Estuary accent regardless of actual region of origin, car with internal stereo that goes thoomp thoomp thoomp, drinks Stella, and thinks dressing smartly involves black moccasin-style shoes with white socks.

karomon
08-04-2003, 09:03 PM
In Poland, this kind of person would be called a wieśniak, literally "village person". Although the word is now often used to describe any corny dumbass you meet on the street, it was originally a reference to a member of the uneducated lower class living in a small village, usually a farmer, usually drunk. There is also a term, burak ("beet"), which I believe came from the usually beet-colored face of a chronic alcoholic. Burak and wieśniak are pretty much interchangable.

BaldTaco
08-04-2003, 09:14 PM
Two more terms:

skid: the 80's metal version of a redneck
wally: a term for skids that I think is specific to Dartmouth, NS, Canada.

For a hilarious look at Canadian rednecks, check out the TV show Trailer Park Boys

Askance
08-04-2003, 09:32 PM
>someone from Manchester is a Mancurian.

Mancunian, is it not?

ruadh
08-05-2003, 03:54 AM
Yes, and someone from Birmingham is a Brummie, not "Brommy". And raygirvan means "as to England", not the UK - Scottish and Welsh rednecks don't speak with Estuary accents.

Shrinking Violet
08-05-2003, 08:13 AM
Originally posted by raygirvan
Fairly recognisable type: close-cropped hair to hide incipient pattern baldness, tattoos with naff designs, big dog, Estuary accent regardless of actual region of origin, car with internal stereo that goes thoomp thoomp thoomp, drinks Stella, and thinks dressing smartly involves black moccasin-style shoes with white socks.

Yep - the very same White Van Man I mentioned earlier in the thread. Often called Wayne. :D

Julie

lieu
08-05-2003, 11:48 AM
Originally posted by RickJay
... cheap applique sweatshirts with dolphins and wolves... Sadly but hilariously, Rick, you are sooooo on the money in your observation.

Trigonal Planar
08-05-2003, 12:30 PM
Ahahaha, dolphins and wolves......that was classic. And oh so true.

Slithy Tove
08-05-2003, 02:01 PM
According to the National Lampoon's "Lemmings," the Hillbillies originally immigrated from Switzerland.

"Hell, I'm a Baptist. I don't wanna guard no Pope!"

raygirvan
08-05-2003, 02:42 PM
Sorry, ruadh; yes, I meant England.

Already in Use
08-06-2003, 06:57 AM
I've met a few Puerto Ricans who hold the same "hick" stereotypes (marrying cousins, etc.) about Mexicans that other Americans hold regarding rural Southerners.

jjimm
08-06-2003, 07:42 AM
In rural Oxfordshire, England, I once went to pick up a used car which I was buying for Ł30. To get it, I had to go to a village I'd never visited before, right out in the middle of nowhere. As I approached the village, I saw that it was dominated by a huge manor house; however, when I drove into the village I found that the manor house was falling over, and the houses around it were like something out of Deliverance's Appalachia. Weird, in-bred looking people eyed me from porches surrounded by dilapidated barns and rusting farm machinery. It was really strange, and rather spooky in a sort of Wicker Man way.

A few years later I worked with some people from this place, and it turned out that many of them were in fact in-bred. Furthermore the "lord of the manor" had inherited the house, and though he was a land millionaire, he lived like a tramp, with wild hair and wilder eyes, riding round on a shagged-out moped with his dog on the fuel-tank and his trousers held up with string.

So yeah, they do exist in England, though I'm sure they wouldn't identify themselves as rednecks.

jovan
08-06-2003, 08:12 AM
Strangely enough, lower-class people who sport obscenely grotesque mullets and drive around on ridiculous choppers and listen to laughably bad rock are refered to as yankees in Japan.

glee
08-06-2003, 11:20 AM
Originally posted by Insecta
[B]Many people in the south of England, particularly in London, regard Northerners as sub human.


Is this supposed to be funny?
It seems about as witty as saying that all the Swiss are bankers who happily colluded with the Nazis in WW2 to steal Jewish bank accounts.

Originally posted by Insecta
A Northerner is anyone in between the Watford Gap service station on the M1 and the Scottish border.


Why stop at the border? It is all one country, you know.

Originally posted by Insecta
For reference, someone from Birmingham is a Brommy, someone from Liverpool is a Scouser and someone from Manchester is a Mancurian. These are not terms of endearment.


As AndrewT and Ruadh said, it's 'Mancunian' and 'Brummie'. I would call Scouser affectionate.

Originally posted by Insecta
If anything, a Northerner is the closest English equivalent of a Redneck, because to some extent, it also symbolizes a north south divide.


So you think a University professor from Manchester is a Redneck?

Originally posted by Insecta
Although I can’t speak so much from experience, Northerners often regard Southerners as snobbish. Cannot imagine why.


And your cite for this 'attitude' of about 20 million people is?
Did you notice the Board motto?

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