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View Full Version : How much time transpires between the Star Wars movies?


Muad'Dib
09-23-2004, 11:46 PM
Because it seems like, at most, the Evil EmpireŠ was around for only about twenty years, and it only took look a few days to train to become a Jedi.

jayjay
09-23-2004, 11:53 PM
Because it seems like, at most, the Evil EmpireŠ was around for only about twenty years, and it only took look a few days to train to become a Jedi.

Well, the Empire really WAS only around for about 20 years at the beginning of A New Hope. Some of the higher-ups in the Rebellion had been (and still were at the beginning of ANH (Mon Mothma, for one)) Senators of the Old Republic, and Palpatine didn't dissolve the Senate until just before Vader caught that blockade runner over Tatooine.

I realize that with the advent of the prequels, this is a pretty obvious fact, but I didn't realize it until one of my college roommates had the Star Wars Encyclopedia back about 10 years ago and I read it there. I was a kid when the first three movies came out and never realized that such a short time had passed since the Empire began, and the prequels were no more than rumor (as part of the fabled ennead of films) at that point.

Burnt Sugar
09-23-2004, 11:55 PM
However, a fair amount of time passes between Star Wars and Empire. Not sure how many but at least a few years.

Silentgoldfish
09-23-2004, 11:56 PM
Whoops! That was me, not Burnt Sugar.

Meleemancer
09-24-2004, 06:00 AM
According to this timeline (http://randomhouse.com/delrey/starwars/timeline.html) of the novels, which is about as official as I could find:

10 years between Episode I and Episode II.
2 years between Episode II and Episode III.
20 years between Episode III and Episode IV.
3 years between Episode IV and Episode V.
1 year between Episode V and Episode VI.

So as the OP says, assuming the Empire is officially founded in Ep 3, it isn't around for much more than twenty years.

HeyHomie
09-24-2004, 09:07 AM
and it only took look a few days to train to become a Jedi.

This has always bothered me. Becoming a Jedi takes years, nay decades. Little children as young as 3 are shipped off to Jedi Preschool, then they go through the whole Padawan - apprentice thing, only to become a true Jedi at the age of, what, 30ish?

Yet Luke Skywalker managers to pull it off in a few days or weeks. :eek:

Best I can figure is that Luke Skywalker was a) exponentially stronger in The Force than any other Jedi trainee before him; and b) given more points for training directly at the knee of Yoda, day in and day out, for a period of time (as opposed to having to attend classes, pudder about at day to day duties with an older trainer, etc., as other Jedis had to do).

Max Carnage
09-24-2004, 09:10 AM
Also, you have to timagine that without hyperdrive, it took a couple of months or so for Han and Leia to get to Bespin, and that Luke was training on Dagobah all that time. Sure that still seems like an awfully short time to go from a white belt to a black belt (metaphorically speaking), but that can be written off by...inherited midichlorians :shudder:

Draelin
09-24-2004, 09:13 AM
Best I can figure is that Luke Skywalker was a) exponentially stronger in The Force than any other Jedi trainee before him; and b) given more points for training directly at the knee of Yoda, day in and day out, for a period of time (as opposed to having to attend classes, pudder about at day to day duties with an older trainer, etc., as other Jedis had to do).

That's how I always figured it. When Yoda originally says Luke is too old to begin training, I thought he meant by a few years, maybe as many as ten. Once the prequels made it clear that an 8-year-old is considered "too old" to start training, that's when Luke's training got even more improbable. But I think Luke, as the son of the Spawn of the Midichlorians, is the (possibly second) strongest Jedi ever to go through training. Yoda's certainly the best teacher a budding young Jedi could have, Luke had a whole bunch of motivation, and no distractions. In addition, his training wasn't complete at Bespin, and he really finished his training himself.

Jonathan Chance
09-24-2004, 10:27 AM
And sometimes you just make do with what you've got.

Kel Varnsen - Latex Division
09-24-2004, 10:43 AM
Luke also "skips" a lot of what we can assume to part of Jedi training (diplomacy, Jedi history, etc.).

Ethilrist
09-24-2004, 10:44 AM
This has always bothered me. Becoming a Jedi takes years, nay decades. Little children as young as 3 are shipped off to Jedi Preschool, then they go through the whole Padawan - apprentice thing, only to become a true Jedi at the age of, what, 30ish?

Yet Luke Skywalker managers to pull it off in a few days or weeks. :eek:

Best I can figure is that Luke Skywalker was a) exponentially stronger in The Force than any other Jedi trainee before him; and b) given more points for training directly at the knee of Yoda, day in and day out, for a period of time (as opposed to having to attend classes, pudder about at day to day duties with an older trainer, etc., as other Jedis had to do).
According to a friend of mine who's read all the books, Qui Gon Jin was wrong. Anakin wasn't the One; Luke was. Going from scruffy-looking nerf herder to inexperienced Jedi in a couple weeks is doable if you're the bestest there ever was.

gonzoron
09-24-2004, 10:46 AM
There's also the fact that as much as I love Luke, he's not a particularly great Jedi. He's got some moves, sure, but he's nothing like the jedis seen in the prequels. He defeats vader, yes, but at that point, Vader's more machine than man, and not jumping around and swinging two sabers at once like he did as Anakin.

Kel Varnsen - Latex Division
09-24-2004, 10:51 AM
There's also the fact that as much as I love Luke, he's not a particularly great Jedi. He's got some moves, sure, but he's nothing like the jedis seen in the prequels. He defeats vader, yes, but at that point, Vader's more machine than man, and not jumping around and swinging two sabers at once like he did as Anakin.


But he was powerful enough to resist the temptation of the darkside. Anakin could not do this.

gonzoron
09-24-2004, 11:22 AM
Indeed, powerful in character and strong in the force, neither of which is necessarily a result of training.

Max Carnage
09-24-2004, 11:26 AM
Heck, he'd only had one five minute lightsaber lesson before Darth Vader recognized the "the force is stong in" Luke.

I've often wondered though. He must have undergone some training somewhere between A New Hope and Empire. He did, after all, learn how to do a force pull to get his saber out of a snow bank. Maybe he bought a Using the Force For Dummies book.

Soapbox Monkey
09-24-2004, 11:48 AM
But he was powerful enough to resist the temptation of the darkside. Anakin could not do this.

I've been pondering the whole "The Chosen One" thing as of late. Anakin is supposedly the one who can bring balance to the force, and yet no one seems to know HOW he's going to do that.

Then I realized, that maybe it was his fall to the darkside. The darkside seems to be this amazingly powerful and seductive side of the force that, once someone falls to it, they can never return. And yet Anakin is redeemed in the end. So maybe that is how he brings balance, by fully experiencing both halves of the force. Falling to the dark but ultimately having the strength to come back to the light brings the prophecy to fulfillment.

TitoBenito
09-24-2004, 11:50 AM
This has always bothered me. Becoming a Jedi takes years, nay decades. Little children as young as 3 are shipped off to Jedi Preschool, then they go through the whole Padawan - apprentice thing, only to become a true Jedi at the age of, what, 30ish?

Yet Luke Skywalker managers to pull it off in a few days or weeks. :eek:

Best I can figure is that Luke Skywalker was a) exponentially stronger in The Force than any other Jedi trainee before him; and b) given more points for training directly at the knee of Yoda, day in and day out, for a period of time (as opposed to having to attend classes, pudder about at day to day duties with an older trainer, etc., as other Jedis had to do).

You also have to through in the fact that for a decade or so the two sith had been living the easy street. Why bother practicing your light saber when you can just mind choke any idiot you want? Whats the point of training when what you know is already lightyears beyond anyone else thanks to the fact you killed everyone on your level. Luke had to train knowing he was fighting an uphill battle. The only way out was victory or death. Meanwhile the emperor and vader are getting softer everyday.

Kel Varnsen - Latex Division
09-24-2004, 12:10 PM
I've been pondering the whole "The Chosen One" thing as of late. Anakin is supposedly the one who can bring balance to the force, and yet no one seems to know HOW he's going to do that.

Then I realized, that maybe it was his fall to the darkside. The darkside seems to be this amazingly powerful and seductive side of the force that, once someone falls to it, they can never return. And yet Anakin is redeemed in the end. So maybe that is how he brings balance, by fully experiencing both halves of the force. Falling to the dark but ultimately having the strength to come back to the light brings the prophecy to fulfillment.

Or maybe it is just when he kills the Emperor destroying the Sith master.

msmith537
09-24-2004, 12:28 PM
There's also the fact that as much as I love Luke, he's not a particularly great Jedi. He's got some moves, sure, but he's nothing like the jedis seen in the prequels. He defeats vader, yes, but at that point, Vader's more machine than man, and not jumping around and swinging two sabers at once like he did as Anakin.

Uh yeah..Anakin lost that fight and Obi Wan took a dive in Episode IV. Was it ever really established (except by rumor and hearsay) that Anakin/Vader was a decent swordsman?


Best I can figure, Obi Wan had trained Luke to wield a lightsaber in Episode I. It does not take a whole lot of training to learn some basic fencing skills. Especially in a universe where everyone uses guns Parry, slash, thrust, block, whatever.

He had the ability in him already (he used it on Hoth to pick up his saber) so it was no problem for Yodi to teach him some basic Force tricks like jumping good and picking up bigger shit without his hands. The Millenium Falcon chase could have been time compressed for the movies and actually taken several weeks. In other words, we just see the scenes with the Falcon being chased by swarms of TIEs and not days upon days of Star Destroyers running search patterns.

No, I think if you take someone with a bit of athletic ability and give him the power to leap 40 feet in the air and move stuff with his mind, it doesn't take a lot of training for him to kick major ass.

And remember Luke did get his ass kicked by Vader in ESB (dad is never too old to kick your ass).



Now if we can figure out how he became a X-Wing pilot in the 20 minutes after the Falcon landed at Yavin, that would be interesting.

Merijeek
09-24-2004, 12:32 PM
This has always bothered me. Becoming a Jedi takes years, nay decades. Little children as young as 3 are shipped off to Jedi Preschool, then they go through the whole Padawan - apprentice thing, only to become a true Jedi at the age of, what, 30ish?

Yet Luke Skywalker managers to pull it off in a few days or weeks. :eek:

Best I can figure is that Luke Skywalker was a) exponentially stronger in The Force than any other Jedi trainee before him; and b) given more points for training directly at the knee of Yoda, day in and day out, for a period of time (as opposed to having to attend classes, pudder about at day to day duties with an older trainer, etc., as other Jedis had to do).

Eh, don't forget that Luke wasn't a typical Jedi.

He didn't get the well-rounded training that your typical academy guy gets - he was designed to be a weapon to destroy Vader and Palpatine.

-Joe

Kel Varnsen - Latex Division
09-24-2004, 12:43 PM
Now if we can figure out how he became a X-Wing pilot in the 20 minutes after the Falcon landed at Yavin, that would be interesting.


Luke was the best pilot in the Outer Rim.

XT
09-24-2004, 01:12 PM
Luke also "skips" a lot of what we can assume to part of Jedi training (diplomacy, Jedi history, etc.).

I think this hits it on the head as far as Luke's training. He only learned the fighting parts of the Force...and even then he didn't learn the deeper mysteries (like shooting out lightning bolts and such). Jedi were sort of like Knights...or like Gunslingers from the Dark Tower. Trained in not only fighting but in all sorts of other things. Its hinted at in the books some of the other duties they had...which Luke was completely unfamiliar with.

Since the Force is inborn in a person, and since Luke had already started probing into the Force BEFORE Yoda and his formal training, and since Luke also was exceptionally talented...and finally since a number of corners were totally cut out...I can mostly buy the compressed time table for his training. Especially in light of the fact he went off half trained, and only completed his training (such as it was completed) later on.

I always thought the Empire had been around a lot longer also. I assumed that in their future people lived a LOT longer...centuries if not more. Also, there was the cloning aspects, so I figured replacement parts were readily available. I think for myself I still like to think of the Empire lasting for centuries at least...makes better sense to me.

-XT

Draelin
09-24-2004, 01:16 PM
In regard to Luke's abilities pre-Ben and Yoda, I hereby sacrifice myself to the alter of ubergeekdom ...

I don't have the book with me here, of course, but in the original novel version of A New Hope (or at least, the one that's sitting on my shelf at home, original or no), there's a passage about the "odd" things Luke could do as a child. The part I remember best is Luke recalling an incident where Uncle Owen was looking for a lost tool of some sort (I want to say screwdriver, but I don't think the nature of the tool is that important). Luke closed his eyes, thought about it for a minute, and promptly announced "It's under the couch."

Uncle Owen found the tool right where Luke said it was. And then promptly punished him for hiding it in the first place.

And Luke learning to fly an X-Wing in 20 minutes is the same as Anakin hopping into a Naboo fighter and nixing the Droid Control Ship--natural talent, previous experience flying similar vehicles, and a little bit o' Force.

Max Carnage
09-24-2004, 01:33 PM
And Luke learning to fly an X-Wing in 20 minutes is the same as Anakin hopping into a Naboo fighter and nixing the Droid Control Ship--natural talent, previous experience flying similar vehicles, and a little bit o' Force.

Oh how I'd love to believe that about Anakin. But the number of "whoooops!" and "what's this button do?" moments made me see him as just full of stupid luck. Of sure you can say the force was guiding his motions, but I'd have liked to see him actually display piloting skill since he would one day be called the greatest pilot in the galaxy.

smiling bandit
09-24-2004, 01:42 PM
Once the prequels made it clear that an 8-year-old is considered "too old" to start training, that's when Luke's training got even more improbable. But I think Luke, as the son of the Spawn of the Midichlorians, is the (possibly second) strongest Jedi ever to go through training.

Eh. I'd say that many of the other SW stuff has made clear that Yoda's comments about being too old didn't have much justification. Age has very little to do with it; its just that the Jedi like training children, who aren't likely to put up as much of a fuss. And it makes them easy to indoctrinate...

I think for myself I still like to think of the Empire lasting for centuries at least...makes better sense to me.

I dunno. More than a few great classical empires lasted about the same time. Often, the very brutality and might that enables the creation of big, powerful regimes ends up destroying them, and a new government (usually a much nicer one) takes over. So, being a historian, its amusing to think of the Empire, Palpatine's grand creation, lasting only 20 years or so.

levdrakon
09-24-2004, 01:55 PM
Another thought about Luke's being a quick study.

Didn't they say that one of the important ways that Jedis, and I suppose anyone in whom the Force is strong, can do what they do is the ability to see immediately into the future? Which would explain how a Jedi can deflect a laser with his light sabre. Even a Jedi can't react faster than light, he just has to know where the light is going to be.

So, if the Force is stronger in you than your opponent, you don't necessarily have to be a better swordsman, since you can see where your opponent is going to strike just a bit before they even know where they're going to strike.

Ike Witt
09-24-2004, 01:55 PM
There's also the fact that as much as I love Luke, he's not a particularly great Jedi. He's got some moves, sure, but he's nothing like the jedis seen in the prequels. He defeats vader, yes, but at that point, Vader's more machine than man, and not jumping around and swinging two sabers at once like he did as Anakin.

Lucas addressed this in a documentary about the lightsabre.. Obi Wan and Vader are older in Star Wars (I refuse to give in to the name change) and Vader is part machine, that is why the fight is kind of boring. Later on you have Luke who wasn't privy to the full training that most Jedis had, but he was young and strong with the force, that is why those fights he had with Vader are a wee bit better than Vader v ObiWan. In the prequels, everyone is more trained and better equipped, and as Lucas put it, the fighting becomes more personal. It stands to reason from what he said that the upcomming fight between Obi Wan and Anakin will be the best lightsabre fight of the series.

Morbo
09-24-2004, 03:40 PM
It stands to reason from what he said that the upcomming fight between Obi Wan and Anakin will be the best lightsabre fight of the series.

I'm hoping for a Dooku / Yoda / Obi Wan / Anakin / Windu / Fett tag team deathmatch. With Padme and Jar Jar suffering a little Collateral Damage.

HPL
09-24-2004, 03:57 PM
And Luke learning to fly an X-Wing in 20 minutes is the same as Anakin hopping into a Naboo fighter and nixing the Droid Control Ship--natural talent, previous experience flying similar vehicles, and a little bit o' Force.

I realize it's not quite the same thing, but Luke mentions being able to fly a T-16, which I imagine is an powered aircraft of sorts. Not quite the same as an X-wing, but he probably already knows the basic flight principles.

And it it might have been a couple days before the Death star made it to the Yavin system.

Draelin
09-24-2004, 04:11 PM
I realize it's not quite the same thing, but Luke mentions being able to fly a T-16, which I imagine is an powered aircraft of sorts. Not quite the same as an X-wing, but he probably already knows the basic flight principles.

Actually, in most other formats (the book, the radio drama version, etc.), it's stated that the T-16 is very similar to the X-Wing, so I think 20 minutes of prep time might be good enough. :)

Morbo
09-24-2004, 04:31 PM
I realize it's not quite the same thing, but Luke mentions being able to fly a T-16

Fly it? Hell, he could bullseye womprats in it!

HPL
09-24-2004, 04:38 PM
Well, remember, he also had that time between the end of Empire and the Beginning of Jedi to train some more, and he seemed to be a better Jedi in the 3rd movie then in the 2nd.

O Desfibrador
09-24-2004, 04:43 PM
My brother explained to me a couple of years ago that the jedis can live a lot of time (i.e. a human jedi usually lives more than 100 years). Fine. He then told me that Mace Windu was some 90 years old in the movies. Fine, again, if they live longer, etc. But then I asked him how much time is supossed to pass between Ep. II and IV and from that we get that Obi Wan was only 50-60 years old when he died... So we get Mace Windu looking young and agile etc. and being 90 years old and Obi Wan an old man with only 50-60 years on his back.

Kel Varnsen - Latex Division
09-24-2004, 04:48 PM
What about Vader's rise in power between IV and V? In IV Tarkin is holding his lease, in V he has carte blanche to kill whomever he wants.

Kaspar Hauser
09-24-2004, 04:51 PM
It's that desert heat.

sturmhauke
09-24-2004, 05:00 PM
Oh how I'd love to believe that about Anakin. But the number of "whoooops!" and "what's this button do?" moments made me see him as just full of stupid luck. Of sure you can say the force was guiding his motions, but I'd have liked to see him actually display piloting skill since he would one day be called the greatest pilot in the galaxy.
That was Lucas being "cute". Remember that Jar-Jar managed to take out a bunch of combat droids basically by accident, tripping over blasters and such. Just pretend they were displaying actual skill, because that's what a director with some meager amount of sense would have done.

levdrakon
09-24-2004, 05:13 PM
What about Vader's rise in power between IV and V? In IV Tarkin is holding his lease, in V he has carte blanche to kill whomever he wants.

Vader was a Sith, and like the Jedi, they tend to be more of a "consultant" than actually subject to anyone's authority. I don't think Vader was ever under anyone's thumb but the Emperor himself.

Muad'Dib
09-24-2004, 05:15 PM
My brother explained to me a couple of years ago that the jedis can live a lot of time (i.e. a human jedi usually lives more than 100 years). Fine. He then told me that Mace Windu was some 90 years old in the movies. Fine, again, if they live longer, etc. But then I asked him how much time is supossed to pass between Ep. II and IV and from that we get that Obi Wan was only 50-60 years old when he died... So we get Mace Windu looking young and agile etc. and being 90 years old and Obi Wan an old man with only 50-60 years on his back.


I've heard it said that Ben completely turned his back on the Force during his exile on Tatoine. Amoung other reasons, he did this to remain hidden from Vader.

Captain Amazing
09-24-2004, 05:18 PM
What about Vader's rise in power between IV and V? In IV Tarkin is holding his lease, in V he has carte blanche to kill whomever he wants.

Well, Tarkin "holding his leash" is a comment by Leia, and she was saying it to get under Tarkin's and Vader's skins. The way I saw it, Tarkin was a high powered Imperial administrator, while Vader was more of a special aide to the emperor. So, the Emperor would say to Vader, "Go and recover the death star plans", or "Go oversee the rest of the construction of the second death star.", and Vader would have whatever authority he needed to do so. So, under the normal course of things, Tarkin has more formal authority than Vader, but, when Vader is on a mission for the Emperor, he has the authority and resources he needs to get the job done, even if it means pulling rank on Tarkin.

Miller
09-24-2004, 06:04 PM
What Captain Amazing said. Vader answers only to the Emperor, but the Emperor values Tarkin's skills and experiences enough that Tarkin can get away with baiting Vader, because he knows the Emperor won't let Vader kill him. On the other hand, if the Emperor ever decided he didn't need Tarkin any more, Vader would have most likely been the one given the task of taking him out.

Mr. Blue Sky
09-24-2004, 06:08 PM
On the other hand, if the Emperor ever decided he didn't need Tarkin any more, Vader would have most likely been the one given the task of taking him out.


Which adds to the list of "Movie Jobs I Don't Want": admiral in the Empirical Forces.

Miller
09-24-2004, 06:13 PM
The Empirical forces? :p

"Captain, we're under attack!"

"Prove it."

Cervaise
09-24-2004, 06:25 PM
With Padme and Jar Jar suffering a little Collateral Damage.Amend that to "the rest of Padme's shirt," and you got yourself a deal.that can be written off by...inherited midichloriansMidichlorians, midichlorians, what is midichlorians?

Mr. Blue Sky
09-24-2004, 06:31 PM
The Empirical forces? :p

"Captain, we're under attack!"

"Prove it."

:smack:

Why does an Empire have "imperial" forces, anyway?

sturmhauke
09-24-2004, 07:32 PM
:smack:

Why does an Empire have "imperial" forces, anyway?
Because "empiral" sounds stupid.

Sir Rhosis
09-24-2004, 11:29 PM
What about Vader's rise in power between IV and V? In IV Tarkin is holding his lease, in V he has carte blanche to kill whomever he wants.

Grand Moff Tarkin, Slumlord!

I have this image of Darth Vader sneaking out of his apartment in the middle of the night, loading all his worldly goods in a Mazda GLC, and getting out of town before the landlord finds out.

:D

Sir Rhosis

Fish
09-25-2004, 03:56 AM
Midichlorians, midichlorians, what is midichlorians?
La la la la la la la la la I can't hear you la la la la LA LA LA LA LA LA LA LA LA!

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