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#1
Old 04-19-2005, 04:58 PM
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Fishing with corn (maize) is illegal. Why?

So it is that time of year, when a man begins to contemplate the hills and mountains, the streams and lakes, imagining the joy of taking his two sons fishing. Of moving out into the wilderness, to become one with his instinctual need to hunt and gather, to grow his beard out as long as he please, and to revel in the heady scent of campfire smoke and mountain pines, away from the restraining influence of spouse and society.

So Im checking the fishing equipment and the fishing regulations and found an interesting clause in the 2005 Utah Fishing Regulations and Information, namely:

Quote:
Section 7
(1)(a) Fishing is permitted with any bait, except corn, hominy, and live fish.
(b) Possession or use of corn or hominy while fishing is unlawful.
So what gives? Why is corn (maize) such an awful thing to fish with? Does it cause an unfair advantage? Some awful fish disease? Fish diabetes?
#2
Old 04-19-2005, 05:08 PM
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Well a guick Google search with the terms 'fishing' and 'corn' seems to indicate that it's a fantastic bait - multiple sites recommend it highly.

So I would guess that maybe if they didn't restrict the use of corn as bait, your area would be quickly overfished?

IANAFisherman, nor a Game Warden.
#3
Old 04-19-2005, 05:11 PM
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I Googled "illegal to fish with corn" and got very few hits other than an old blog that contained this line:

Quote:
The fisheries stock the streams and rivers up there with farm-grown trout, and the keepers feed the fish corn from the time that they are little fingerlings until they turn them loose. They'll bite on that bait like a crack-whore on a rock.
Take it for what it's worth.
#4
Old 04-19-2005, 05:14 PM
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I found this page, but it sounds like the author has an ax to grind, so I don't know how accurate it is
Quote:
This paranoia of corn [bait in Utah] stems from the late 60's and very early 70's when corn was commonly used as a bait for Rainbow Trout. Many fisherman of the era, thinking if a little was good, a lot would be better, began to chum (groundbait) with whole dry kernel corn. Often this was a fifty or hundred pound sack of feed corn tossed over the side of their boat. The DWR held a common misconception of the time that the consumption of dried corn would kill trout. This was later proven in laboratory tests by the Pennsylvania Division of Boating and Fisheries to be absolutely false.

Anyway, since chumming was seen as un-sportsmanlike conduct, a total ban on fishing with corn for all species of fish ("A pound of prevention is worth an ounce of cure") has been kept on the books for over 30 years with no scientific reasoning behind it. To this day the DWR is afraid someone might be tempted to chum with dry corn again. As fisheries director Tom Pettengill put it in a recent email to me: "We just don't want to go there".
#5
Old 04-19-2005, 05:30 PM
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Corn and live fish are legal as bait in every state I have fished in the upper Midwest, and are very popular and effective. I have not fished Utah, but in western Colorado I found fishable waters and catches were a lot harder to come by than in the Midwest. I am going to guess that the Utah DNR is trying to extend the availability of a limited fish population.
#6
Old 04-19-2005, 08:17 PM
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In PA, you can chum w/corn all you want, but you could get charged with littering.
#7
Old 04-19-2005, 09:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Blue Sky
I Googled "illegal to fish with corn" and got very few hits other than an old blog that contained this line:
Take it for what it's worth.
I call BS on that blog. Every hatchery I've been to fed their trout pellet food, similar what is advetised here.

Hmm, I always thought canned corn was deadly to trout because they couldn't digest it. Perhaps I was taken in by Fish & Game propaganda.
#8
Old 04-20-2005, 01:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by uncited blog
They'll bite on that bait like a crack-whore on a rock.
Admittedly off-topc, but that line reminds me of a King of the Hill episode where Hank unknowingly fishes for bass with crack.
#9
Old 04-20-2005, 01:27 PM
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So, what kind of corn is best to fish with? Creamed corn? Yellow? White? Indian? What about cornbread? When fish eat corn and poop does it reconstruct itself and come out in whole kernels like in people?
#10
Old 04-20-2005, 02:26 PM
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This measure is in place to protect the fly fishing tourist trade.

Corn is nigh-irresistible to trout. Trout are frequently overfished, to the point that many states maintain costly restocking programs. States do this because fly fishing is an important tourist draw. If people get to "cheat" by fishing for trout with corn, it can quickly deplete the fish population and undercut the state's efforts to promote fly fishing.
#11
Old 04-20-2005, 02:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KeithP
So, what kind of corn is best to fish with? Creamed corn? Yellow? White? Indian? What about cornbread? When fish eat corn and poop does it reconstruct itself and come out in whole kernels like in people?
For trout, the drill I've heard goes like this: Throw out some frozen corn (separate kernels, not big lumps.) Then bait your hook with a thawed kernel or two. The theory is that the trout will bite, and spit out, the frozen corn. When they get your thawed corn, they'll eat that. Why do trout want corn? It resembles fish eggs, which they naturally eat.

Carp are a game fish in the UK, (so I've read) and many other places. We Yanks snub the carp, and we call it a trash fish. So, corn and carp. I'm sure there are many variations, but here is one.

Start with dried corn, and boil it with strawberry jam and lots of sugar. Carp are vegetarians, and they allegedly like sweet and red. Make a rig, as follows. On the end of your line, attach a one-ounce weight (lead is unfashionable now.) From there, attach about 18''-24" of line. At the end of that, a small lump of plastic foam for flotation and a hook with one or two of your boiled sweetened corn kernels.

Cast out your rig, which will suspend the bait a couple feet off the bottom. Toss out some sweetened corn to attract the carp, and wait. When you get a bite, you are in for a fight!
#12
Old 04-20-2005, 03:14 PM
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When I read the thread title, I thought is was referring to fishing in a corn maze.

Crack anyone?
#13
Old 04-20-2005, 04:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Philster
When I read the thread title, I thought is was referring to fishing in a corn maze.
Sorry for the disappoinment there, Philster. I was just trying to be clear for our international community...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Philster
Crack anyone?
So are you recommending cracked corn as bait? Is that legal?
#14
Old 04-20-2005, 04:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scarface Z
Every hatchery I've been to fed their trout pellet food, similar what is advetised here.
Hmm, I always thought canned corn was deadly to trout because they couldn't digest it. Perhaps I was taken in by Fish & Game propaganda.
The fish pellets being fed in the hatcheries has been my experience here, also. So I highly doubt the "they get fed corn as fingerlings" blog as well.

The idea that they want to limit the fishing makes some sense, though. Thanks to everyone for that insight.

I guess the follow on question is: Why do trout love corn so much, rather than, say, wheat, oatmeal, sorghum, or something else from the Gramineae family. Is it the color? The scent? The strange colors the trout see after they've taken a hit?
#15
Old 04-20-2005, 04:40 PM
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Corny Thread Sounds Fishy to Me

This brings new meaning to the lyric:

"Jimmy cracked corn and I don't care"

Perhaps Jimmy was fishing!

Peter

Http://thePeterFiles.blogspot.com
#16
Old 04-20-2005, 05:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AskNott
For trout, the drill I've heard goes like this: Throw out some frozen corn (separate kernels, not big lumps.) Then bait your hook with a thawed kernel or two.
Hijack here: excuse me, aren't we promoting illegal activity? Let's say this thread, instead of being about illegal fishing bait that grows naturally and is commonly used because it works so well, were about an herb that grows naturally all over the world and, despite having been used medicinally for thousands of years and depsite having been made illegal by some puritanical, misguided law in the mid-1930's, is commonly used because....it works so well. Then someone (no dis intended to AskNott; it could be me or anyone) comes along and gives advice concerning how to use said herb. MODERATOR ALERT! THREAD SHUTDOWN IN PROGRESS!

Don't get me wrong, I'm just saying...
#17
Old 04-20-2005, 05:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sequent
Hijack here: excuse me, aren't we promoting illegal activity? Let's say this thread, instead of being about illegal fishing bait that grows naturally and is commonly used because it works so well...
Okay, so I'm in Mexico. Can someone tell me how to use corn as bait here? It's not illegal.
#18
Old 04-20-2005, 06:11 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Balthisar
Okay, so I'm in Mexico. Can someone tell me how to use corn as bait here? It's not illegal.
Glue corn to the dynamite before throwing it into the lake ?
#19
Old 04-20-2005, 06:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sequent
Hijack here: excuse me, aren't we promoting illegal activity?
Easy there, Sequent. If you will carefully read the OP, I am not asking "How can I get away with using corn while fishing," I am asking why it is illegal and (later) why fish find it so attractive. If someone posted a thread on the afore mentioned "herb" and what medicinal use it has, and how the "medicinal substance" works, and then some yahoo came along and posts information on how to GROW the stuff.... Well, it ain't the thread, it's the poster who is out of line.

Besides, further research indicates that the situation we are discussing here is illegal only in Utah and Oregon, as far as I can gather. As few of us Dopers as there are in those two states (sorry folks), as compared to the whole board, I think we are well within the boundries of legal discussion. That being said, however, in no way do I wish to encourage any illegal activity. Check with your state's regulations and guidelines. Blah, blah, blah. Etc. etc. etc.
#20
Old 04-20-2005, 07:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sequent
Hijack here: excuse me, aren't we promoting illegal activity? ...

Don't get me wrong, I'm just saying...
Most US states, and most of the rest of the world, have no regs against fishing with corn. Although the OP asked about Utah (which prohibits it,) the post I quoted had no location and gave no indication that the poster was in Utah or any no-corn state. KiethP asked what kind of corn works best, and I gave it my best shot.

Some areas tailor their fishing rules to prevent overfishing, and I have no problem with that. At least one Canadian province prohibits barbed hooks, and nearly every place has some limits on the size and number of fish you may take. I do not advocate breaking the fishing rules anywhere.

I'm just hoping for a fish locator that tells me whether the fish are laughing at me.
#21
Old 04-20-2005, 07:33 PM
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Quote:
Start with dried corn, and boil it with strawberry jam and lots of sugar. Carp are vegetarians, and they allegedly like sweet and red.
I used to go fishing on the canal when I was younger. One time, I was at a spot a few metres from an old man. He was using redworms (I think) as bait. He pulled a fish out literally every ten minutes, whereas I didn't catch anything (possibly indicative of something else other than choice of bait :-P).

I've heard that in a lot of fishing competitions, red bait is banned because some fish find it so irresistable.
#22
Old 04-20-2005, 07:34 PM
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You could always try some of these:

Berkley Gulp! Corn

or

Corn scented bait nuggets

or

Exude corn niblets

While not corn, they're probably the next closest thing if you can't use the real thing.
#23
Old 04-20-2005, 07:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AskNott
I'm just hoping for a fish locator that tells me whether the fish are laughing at me.
Take it from me, they're laughing at you. Not to worry, they laugh at me too.
#24
Old 04-20-2005, 07:55 PM
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Yeah, yeah, yeah...the other herb to which I alluded is legal on several unincorporated, uninhabited stretches of sand in the Pacific....like this place. So there.

Sorry, I'm just feeling a little persecuted on this, the 20th day of the 4th month of the year. But I'm feeling much better now.
#25
Old 04-20-2005, 09:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KeithP
So, what kind of corn is best to fish with? Creamed corn? Yellow? White? Indian? What about cornbread? When fish eat corn and poop does it reconstruct itself and come out in whole kernels like in people?
I've always heard of canned corn being used. However, this and other techniques may just be regional traditions.

Note: Corn also works for eels, and I hates the eels.
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