Reply
Thread Tools Display Modes
#1
Old 06-10-2007, 03:06 PM
Guest
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Bay Area, California
Posts: 4,811
How does 480p Widescreen (16:9) work?

Rather, I vaguely understand how it works, but I'm wondering whether it's actually "better" than 480p full-screen (4:3).

To my understanding, both formats involve the same number of pixels, and even initial display ratio. However, when in wide-screen, the image appears squished until I manually set my 4:3 TV to wid-screen mode, thereby letter-boxing the top and bottom portions, giving the images a widescreen ratio.

What prompted this question was Twilight Princess for Wii. I've done comparisons, and the widescreen mode certainly enables one to see slightly more along the horizontal access, and loses nothing along the vertical. This seems to suggest that, since both formats use the same resolution, that there's a loss of detail in the widescreen image, otherwise how could they fit more into the same resolution?

Is my assumption correct, or am I totally off base?

Last edited by Red Barchetta; 06-10-2007 at 03:09 PM.
#2
Old 06-10-2007, 04:34 PM
Guest
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Phoenix, AZ
Posts: 15,368
I don't believe that's the case. Are you thinking the p in 480p means pixels? It actually stands for progressive scan resolution, and the 480 is the number of lines from top to bottom, which is about the same on both 4:3 and 16:9 ratios. (These display ratios aren't the same, which took me a while to realize myself; 4:3 is equivalent to 16:12, not 16:9.)

The number of lines from left to right does in fact change. According to the 480p Wiki page, it's 704 or 720 lines for 4:3 and 854 lines for 16:9. So 4:3 works out to about 720x480 for screen resolution and 16:9 is 854x480 in 480p display.

That's kind of a jumble of numbers, but there is definitely more graphical information in widescreen mode than in standard 4:3.

ETA: Fool I am, the Wiki page actually describes the 4:3 ratio as 640x480 and the 16:9 ratio as 720x480. Completely missed that.

Last edited by BayleDomon; 06-10-2007 at 04:36 PM.
#3
Old 06-10-2007, 04:46 PM
Guest
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Bay Area, California
Posts: 4,811
Quote:
Originally Posted by BayleDomon
I don't believe that's the case. Are you thinking the p in 480p means pixels?
No, I realize it stands for "progressive." I suppose in retrospect, I should have written it as 480i/480p.

Quote:
Originally Posted by BayleDomon
The number of lines from left to right does in fact change. According to the 480p Wiki page, it's 704 or 720 lines for 4:3 and 854 lines for 16:9. So 4:3 works out to about 720x480 for screen resolution and 16:9 is 854x480 in 480p display.
Hmm, interesting. I'm confused then: When my TV isn't set to "widescreen" mode, it still displays the full picture (so far as I can tell), just stretched to fill the whole screen. Is my still displaying the full horiztonal pixel width, despite not being set to "widescreen"?
#4
Old 06-10-2007, 04:57 PM
Guest
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Phoenix, AZ
Posts: 15,368
I'm not sure what you're asking, really. You have an image set to display in widescreen, such as HDTV or the Wii configured for 16:9 (I just finished playing Twilight Princess myself in widescreen, such an enjoyable experience), but the TV itself isn't set to widescreen. In that case, the widescreen view would be scrunched into 4:3, yeah? I don't know what happens to the extra lines there, though.

Alternately, you have a 4:3 image and your TV is set to widescreen, which will stretch the image out. Again, I couldn't really say what the TV does to 'fill in' the extra lines.

I'm afraid my technical level isn't high enough to explain what the TV's doing in either case. I just know enough to be able to say that images configured for 16:9 will have more detail than 4:3 images (or the same detail per square inch, just more square inches), regardless of how the TV is displaying them. I'll bow out from here for more knowledgeable posters to come in.
#5
Old 06-10-2007, 05:01 PM
Guest
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Bay Area, California
Posts: 4,811
Quote:
Originally Posted by BayleDomon
I'm afraid my technical level isn't high enough to explain what the TV's doing in either case. I just know enough to be able to say that images configured for 16:9 will have more detail than 4:3 images (or the same detail per square inch, just more square inches), regardless of how the TV is displaying them. I'll bow out from here for more knowledgeable posters to come in.
You answered my initial questions and I know my followup made not have made the most sense, but you got the essence of what I was asking. Thanks!
#6
Old 06-10-2007, 08:01 PM
Charter Member
Moderator
Join Date: Jan 2000
Location: The Land of Cleves
Posts: 73,158
It sounds to me like your TV doesn't have enough pixels to display a full-sized widescreen image, so yes, on your TV, widescreen mode would imply some loss of detail. But on a true widescreen TV, the widescreen image would fill the screen, and a 4:3 image would be "letterboxed" with black bands on the left and right.
__________________
Time travels in divers paces with divers persons.
--As You Like It, III:ii:328
Check out my dice in the Marketplace
#7
Old 06-11-2007, 02:42 AM
Guest
Join Date: Aug 2001
Posts: 7,083
The OP may be thinking of how "anamorphic" widescreen DVDs work, which is as he describes. The images on a 4:3 DVD and and anamorphic 16:9 DVD contain the same number of pixels in both directions, it's just that the 16:9 image is then scaled either by stretching horizontally (on a 16:9 TV) or by omitting scanlines (on a 4:3 TV).

Whether the Wii uses this technique or really does produce a higher resolution picture in widescreen mode, I don't know. A quick Google suggests that maybe it does use anamorphic.
#8
Old 06-11-2007, 03:08 AM
Guest
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Bay Area, California
Posts: 4,811
Quote:
Originally Posted by Usram
Whether the Wii uses this technique or really does produce a higher resolution picture in widescreen mode, I don't know. A quick Google suggests that maybe it does use anamorphic.
Hmm, interesting. Thank for the reply!

So if the Wii uses that same method, does that mean it might be sacrificing some picture quality in the process?
#9
Old 06-11-2007, 03:53 AM
Guest
Join Date: Aug 2001
Posts: 7,083
Quote:
Originally Posted by Red Barchetta
So if the Wii uses that same method, does that mean it might be sacrificing some picture quality in the process?
If it is producing anamorphic 16:9, then it is more a case of it not providing any extra detail than in 4:3 mode. If you then view that 16:9 image squashed to fit into a 4:3 frame while retaining the aspect ratio, you are losing scanlines.

Last edited by Ximenean; 06-11-2007 at 03:57 AM.
#10
Old 06-11-2007, 04:41 AM
Guest
Join Date: Oct 1999
Location: Belfast Northern Ireland
Posts: 6,590
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chronos
It sounds to me like your TV doesn't have enough pixels to display a full-sized widescreen image, so yes, on your TV, widescreen mode would imply some loss of detail. But on a true widescreen TV, the widescreen image would fill the screen, and a 4:3 image would be "letterboxed" with black bands on the left and right.
I'm going to have to check this out, because I'm pretty sure the TV's back at my parents don't fill the screen with either. 4:3 is letterboxed vertically as described, but any "widescreen" mode has to be scaled to show up properly. Maybe I don't have any proper widescreen DVDs/Videos to try on it.
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is Off
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 08:10 AM.

Copyright © 2017
Best Topics: nguyen pronunciation audio dr girlfriend most powerful explosive lucifer's hammer sequel citizenship gifts ideas heroin taste penis cyst civ building games world publishing bible afrin rebound trespass warrant yoohoo mixed drink ethernet punch tool sex with apes king dong snack 127 takes diet soda aftertaste chicken parmesan side body gem fred gwynne imdb why chopsticks patio tv dinners popeyes lyrics military toilet paper pato spanish vulva kick metroid prime controls upack pod men inserting tampons vaporized metal apocalypse wwi hydroxyquinoline sulfate games like civclicker rounder definition slang how much money is in a band of 100s is veterinarian a good career a justice of the peace must have a law degree to be appointed to the position is textbooks com a legit site clarity enhanced diamond vs natural do you have to have a mailbox what to wear to a funeral men no suit mr mom movie quotes clothes for the poor glass glue home depot background check wrong employment dates does tivo work without subscription nanny nanny boo boo stick your head in doo doo what does a 300 lb woman look like chocolate makes me sick can a cold be spread through intercourse professional grade pots and pans the princess bride book 1st edition who starred in mcmillan and wife water dripping from exhaust why are blacks so loud how long does food stay in a cat's stomach does a hot shower take the sting out of sunburn 2000 flushes turns water pink how to get a donated car from goodwill where to recycle encyclopedias water tastes like milk protectionism is sometimes necessary in trade spots on eyeglasses that won't come off comcast modem mac address change why did it take so long for texas to become a state ear wax removal walgreens