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#1
Old 12-25-2008, 06:58 PM
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Question about parents kicking their kids out at 18

Let's say the parents either despise the kid or feel the best "tough love" is to kick them out of the house the instant they turn 18.

Can they kick them out at the stroke of midnight on the 18th birthday, or do they have to serve some sort of "eviction notice" and give them time?
#2
Old 12-25-2008, 07:48 PM
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AFAIK and IANAL, you can't really ever just kick someone out of the home they've been living in. You have to have them evicted, which can take at least 30 days unless they've been committing a crime, in which case you can give them 24 or 48 hours notice to evict.
#3
Old 12-25-2008, 07:59 PM
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Originally Posted by Alice The Goon View Post
AFAIK and IANAL, you can't really ever just kick someone out of the home they've been living in. You have to have them evicted, which can take at least 30 days unless they've been committing a crime, in which case you can give them 24 or 48 hours notice to evict.
Hmm, that seems like some interesting legal theory. Parents of older teenagers kick them out all the time. I have never heard of any legal challenges to it even on these boards from the kids. Some of them are drug users and have conditions on which they can stay. If they use, they are out and some people follow through with the threat. If the kid isn't paying rent and is over 18, I don't see the problem. That is but one example. I have known lots of people that freeloaded off of relatives and got kicked out for misbehavior no matter how old they are. It seems reasonable to me.

Last edited by Shagnasty; 12-25-2008 at 08:00 PM.
#4
Old 12-25-2008, 08:03 PM
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Also, what about moving house and just not inviting them along? Is that different?
#5
Old 12-25-2008, 08:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alice The Goon View Post
AFAIK and IANAL, you can't really ever just kick someone out of the home they've been living in. You have to have them evicted, which can take at least 30 days unless they've been committing a crime, in which case you can give them 24 or 48 hours notice to evict.
That is an interesting legal theory at least for the US. Most eviction statutes are based on contract law not some nebulous regard for where someone has lived.
#6
Old 12-25-2008, 08:37 PM
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In any city I've lived in, lock-out evictions are not legal, and if the lockee calls the police, the homeowner will be forced to let the other person back in. They will be advised to have the person legally evicted. The length of time until a guest is considered a tenant apparently varies from state to state, but when I lived in South Carolina, if someone even spent one night in your home, and didn't want to leave, you had to legally evict them. Sounds pretty crazy, but the police aren't going to get involved in this sort of domestic matter- it's civil.
#7
Old 12-25-2008, 09:08 PM
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Originally Posted by Alice The Goon View Post
In any city I've lived in, lock-out evictions are not legal, and if the lockee calls the police, the homeowner will be forced to let the other person back in. They will be advised to have the person legally evicted. The length of time until a guest is considered a tenant apparently varies from state to state, but when I lived in South Carolina, if someone even spent one night in your home, and didn't want to leave, you had to legally evict them. Sounds pretty crazy, but the police aren't going to get involved in this sort of domestic matter- it's civil.
That does sound crazy if not outright bizarre. I am positive that it isn't true for all states (like my home state of Louisiana which has a different legal system and probably not for many more states). I hardly ever asked for cites but do you have any evidence for this claim? If I allow a friend to stay over at my house for the night and he simply refuses to leave and becomes a squatter, I would hope that I could just call the police and have him or her kicked out. If the person steps outside, can't I just lock them out, refuse them re-entry? It is my house after all and I have young children.

I think you need to provide some more evidence for this claim. I have never heard of it and the complications it could cause make my mind spin. In short, I don't believe it at all and I certainly hope that it isn't true in any place in the U.S.

Last edited by Shagnasty; 12-25-2008 at 09:10 PM.
#8
Old 12-25-2008, 09:13 PM
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Just because cops are not willing to get involved in a legal squable on the street does not mean any legal theory gives freeloaders a right to stay. Cops are not in a position to review legal documents like deeds or leases to determine who has the right to evict whom. But if the person leaves and you throw all their stuff on the street and change the locks and prevent them from entering the cops certainly are not going to make you let them in. But you are right to the extent you want a court order for someone to leave you do have to go through the legal steps and that does take time. But that is not because they have a right to stay but rather because you can't just walk up to a judge and say here is my deed order him out. The judge is going to want to hear both sides of the story. But if you physically evict someone with a lease without complying with the legal process they can recover damages but a freeloader cannot.
#9
Old 12-25-2008, 09:28 PM
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Originally Posted by Shagnasty View Post

I think you need to provide some more evidence for this claim. I have never heard of it and the complications it could cause make my mind spin. In short, I don't believe it at all and I certainly hope that it isn't true in any place in the U.S.

I know that at first glance it seems crazy that you, the homeowner, can't just one day kick your housemates to the curb, family or non-related roommates. But you can't. People have a constitutional right to due process. I went through several pages of google search for cites, and can really only find citeless message board answers like this, this and this, and this, but I know from real life experience that people that have been living somewhere can not just be put out. I don't know why I can't find any legitimate cites, but I guess it's a state issue.

Sure, you could take the chance that the adult child won't know they have this right, and will just go away, but if they call the police, the police will make you let them back in- the very reason is because of course they're not going to go through a bunch of domestic "she did this" and "he did that" squabbling bullshit. A court order for eviction is clear-cut and obviously legal, and they will enforce that. Could you imagine what if people were allowed to put their housemates out on the street on a whim? Nope, you can't self-evict, if someone has been living there a certain amount of time. I don't know if SC law has changed- this was about 15 years ago that my apartment manager told me of the law there, with the one-night thing.

Last edited by Alice The Goon; 12-25-2008 at 09:29 PM.
#10
Old 12-25-2008, 09:40 PM
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Alice, the constitution does not apply to private individuals.

Quote:
I don't know why I can't find any legitimate cites
I do.

Last edited by askeptic; 12-25-2008 at 09:41 PM.
#11
Old 12-25-2008, 09:43 PM
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Originally Posted by Alice The Goon View Post
I know that at first glance it seems crazy that you, the homeowner, can't just one day kick your housemates to the curb, family or non-related roommates. But you can't. People have a constitutional right to due process. I went through several pages of google search for cites, and can really only find citeless message board answers like this, this and this, and this, but I know from real life experience that people that have been living somewhere can not just be put out. I don't know why I can't find any legitimate cites, but I guess it's a state issue.

Sure, you could take the chance that the adult child won't know they have this right, and will just go away, but if they call the police, the police will make you let them back in- the very reason is because of course they're not going to go through a bunch of domestic "she did this" and "he did that" squabbling bullshit. A court order for eviction is clear-cut and obviously legal, and they will enforce that. Could you imagine what if people were allowed to put their housemates out on the street on a whim? Nope, you can't self-evict, if someone has been living there a certain amount of time. I don't know if SC law has changed- this was about 15 years ago that my apartment manager told me of the law there, with the one-night thing.
This is probably going to degenerate into a bunch of state based legal trivia but, in my home state of Louisiana, you can just order the person out and then shoot to kill if they don't comply especially if they aren't related and are harassing either people or property. There is case law on this and it is well documented both here and in the media and it has played out to deadly consequences in real life. Other states do not have such a liberal interpretation of home invasion but, even in Massachusetts, I have never heard of anything like this. States obviously vary a lot but I cannot imagine say, a Texas coworker, telling me over the phone that she is having trouble hearing a conference call because a cousin came into town last night, refuses to leave, and is snoring next to her desk and she can't do anything about it until the courts order it. It doesn't make sense.
#12
Old 12-25-2008, 09:49 PM
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And if a court denies to evict? That does sound awfully strange. I can understand a landlord/renter situation, but kicking out your kids or a bum of a friend? That should fly.
#13
Old 12-25-2008, 09:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by askeptic View Post
That is an interesting legal theory at least for the US. Most eviction statutes are based on contract law not some nebulous regard for where someone has lived.
My limited experience in Florida was if that the person had been living there long enough for it to be considered their primary residence, the owner of the house better NOT just kick em out without legal notification and "due process", lest the kicker get into big trouble from the kickie.
#14
Old 12-25-2008, 10:03 PM
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Originally Posted by Alice The Goon View Post
People have a constitutional right to due process.
Actually they don't. The fifth and fourteenth amendments provides that no person shall be deprived of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; and this only applies to the government unless US Statute 1983 can somehow be invoked. But even if it applied to private persons it still would not apply here. If the person has no right to reside in your home then kicking them out is not depriving them of life liberty or property.

(For you legal scholars, if you bring up adverse possession I will force you to recite the rule against perpetuities and give three examples where it does apply while hanging naked by your feet over a pit of horny starving gorillas...)
#15
Old 12-25-2008, 10:09 PM
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Originally Posted by Shagnasty View Post
I cannot imagine say, a Texas coworker, telling me over the phone that she is having trouble hearing a conference call because a cousin came into town last night, refuses to leave, and is snoring next to her desk and she can't do anything about it until the courts order it. It doesn't make sense.
OP asked about a minor being kicked out of their primary residence at the stroke of midnight on their 18th birthday. I am not certain of the relevance of this.

Also, my reading of Louisana Code of Civil Procedure Section 4702 seems to imply any occupant who is not bound by a lease must be served with a notice to vacate, and given at least 5 days to vacate the property.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Shagnasty
in my home state of Louisiana, you can just order the person out and then shoot to kill if they don't comply especially if they aren't related and are harassing either people or property.
Cite?
#16
Old 12-25-2008, 10:17 PM
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Originally Posted by IAmNotSpartacus View Post
OP asked about a minor being kicked out of their primary residence at the stroke of midnight on their 18th birthday. I am not certain of the relevance of this.

Also, my reading of Louisana Code of Civil Procedure Section 4702 seems to imply any occupant who is not bound by a lease must be served with a notice to vacate, and given at least 5 days to vacate the property.


Cite?

I think you are reading it wrong. A person who rents month to month may not have a lease but that statute would protect them. However I doubt it applies to a house guest who decides he doesn't want to leave.
#17
Old 12-25-2008, 10:18 PM
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Considering the title of the section is "Notice to occupant other than tenant to vacate," I'm going to go with my original reading.
#18
Old 12-25-2008, 10:25 PM
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Too late to edit, but Section 4704 of the same code defines "occupant" as the following:
Quote:
"Occupant" includes a sharecropper; half hand; day laborer; former owner; and any person occupying immovable property by permission or accommodation of the owner, former owner, or another occupant, except a mineral lessee, owner of a mineral servitude, or a lessee of the owner;
Bolding is mine.
#19
Old 12-25-2008, 10:28 PM
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Originally Posted by IAmNotSpartacus View Post
Considering the title of the section is "Notice to occupant other than tenant to vacate," I'm going to go with my original reading.
I'm gonna guess that it applies to someone the tenant has let live there that the landlord wants out. Not someone who is a guest in your own home.

A parent may have an obligation to provide for the comfort and care of a child but there is no obligation to allow them in your home. Notice all the boarding schools and military schools? Once the child turns eighteen you are not obligated by law to provide anything and they essentially become a guest in your home.
#20
Old 12-25-2008, 10:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IAmNotSpartacus View Post

Cite?
Per cite. This one isn't hard. There is case law on this and we have talked about it here many times before. A Japanese exchange student, Yoshihiro Hattori, was shot dead in Baton Rouge in 1992 by a homeowner when he went to the wrong address for a Halloween party and refused to comply with the order to leave. Louisiana law allows lethal defense for protection of both people and property. There was a language barrier and the event was extremely unfortunate but the homeowner was still acquitted. It was an international media case but the law still found in favor of the homeowner.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yoshihiro_Hattori

The owner of the small supermarket chain where I worked in high-school in the late 1980's even before that walked in to his house to find his wife sleeping with another man (in all senses). A fight ensued and he ordered him to leave. It didn't work out cleanly and the man was shot and killed. I don't even think it ever went to trial because it was so cut and dried because it took place in his own home and the man refused to leave. I had a (male) babysitter kill someone on his own property for not as clear cut reasons but it never went to trial. I still liked him although I though his judgment could have been better. You don't want to screw around with orders to leave a property Louisiana. It doesn't have the same legal system as the rest of the states so I doubt this thread would fly at all there.

The states are wildly different when it comes to these matters.

Last edited by Shagnasty; 12-25-2008 at 10:40 PM.
#21
Old 12-25-2008, 10:36 PM
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Originally Posted by askeptic View Post
I'm gonna guess that it applies to someone the tenant has let live there that the landlord wants out. Not someone who is a guest in your own home.

In my Florida experience, if the person "lived" there, thats all it took for formal proceedings to be required.

So, my basic understanding was, if the cops showed up and talked to some neighbors, or the person could show some mail addressed to them at that address, formal eviction proceedings would be required, regardless of any or lack of any lease/rent payments....


IIRC, the only real difference between a renter with a lease/contract and somebody who "just lived there" was how much notice you had to give before it became official.
#22
Old 12-25-2008, 10:43 PM
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I am not seeing how a foreign exchange student going to the wrong house applies to an instance of a minor being kicked out by their parents at the stroke of midnight on the minor's 18th birthday.

Can you reconcile what your cite has to do with the OP?

I apologize if if I was unclear in my request for a cite relevant to the OP, I thought it was a given.

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Originally Posted by Shagnasty View Post
Per cite. This one isn't hard.
#23
Old 12-25-2008, 10:56 PM
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Originally Posted by IAmNotSpartacus View Post
I am not seeing how a foreign exchange student going to the wrong house applies to an instance of a minor being kicked out by their parents at the stroke of midnight on the minor's 18th birthday.

Can you reconcile what your cite has to do with the OP?

I apologize if if I was unclear in my request for a cite relevant to the OP, I thought it was a given.
No problem. My mind is spinning with various scenarios scenarios on this. I have a very nice house with two very young daughters. I also have at least two relatives with serious substance abuse problems and recent criminal records. They have hung around the house before but they are not allowed to get even close to it now no matter what. They could argue to the police that they have lived there and that I would have to give formal evictions. That is not my responsibility as a father and a homeowner. I shouldn't have to prove that a lowlife doesn't belong in my house (the two people that control it are already on the deed). There is no way that could ever happen and I have never heard of such a thing.

The whole logic doesn't make sense. Anyone could claim that they lived anywhere and force the owners to go to court to get them out. Homeless people could use that all the time. I am trying to identify the logic of all of this. Once the person is in, what can they do? Eat your food? Take 45 minute showers three times a day? Wake everyone up in the middle of the night for fun? The police can't do anything to an adult for this? I don't believe it.
#24
Old 12-25-2008, 11:01 PM
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Originally Posted by Shagnasty View Post
The whole logic doesn't make sense. Anyone could claim that they lived anywhere and force the owners to go to court to get them out. Homeless people could use that all the time. I am trying to identify the logic of all of this. Once the person is in, what can they do? Eat your food? Take 45 minute showers three times a day? Wake everyone up in the middle of the night for fun? The police can't do anything to an adult for this? I don't believe it.

Yes. anybody can claim anything...but still, the police are gonna want some proof one way or another before they make a call either way.

If that lowlife has 6 months of mail and their own bedroom, you might be SOL for some period of time.

If its just some guy on the front lawn claiming he lives there, you are probably AOKAY.
#25
Old 12-25-2008, 11:15 PM
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I am thinking in hypotheticals. You shouldn't shoot to kill your own children on their 18th birthday obviously or anyone else for that matter but I can't see why you would ever be forced to have a person in your own house that you don't want if they aren't paying rent and don't have a contract with if they are an adult.

Like a lot of these types of GQ questions, it is mostly theoretical rather than practical otherwise someone would need to see a lawyer. Could you have your own house overrun by delusional heroin zombies and have to pay to get them out of your own house anywhere in the U.S. with the police refusing to do much of anything just because you gave them a bed for a few days over the holidays?

Last edited by Shagnasty; 12-25-2008 at 11:20 PM.
#26
Old 12-26-2008, 12:20 AM
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Originally Posted by askeptic View Post
That is an interesting legal theory at least for the US. Most eviction statutes are based on contract law not some nebulous regard for where someone has lived.
An ex sister in law was living in Las Vegas with some guy. They had a falling out and she wanted him out of the apartment. They had been living together for a year or so. During that time he never worked and she did. She paid all the bills, the place was in her name, etc.

When she called the cops to get him thrown out they said (according to her), "If his clothes are here then he lives here and we can't throw him out."

She did finally get rid of him and moved back east.

This wasn't all that long ago, perhaps 2 years.
#27
Old 12-26-2008, 12:45 AM
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Originally Posted by Shagnasty View Post
I can't see why you would ever be forced to have a person in your own house that you don't want if they aren't paying rent and don't have a contract with if they are an adult.
IANAL, but in my own recent expeditions in lease and eviction law, I have learned it is indeed a crime in many states to evict by "self help," (without legal due process). Now, I think the law will understand a vast difference between someone crashing on your couch for a night that won't leave the next morning and someone that was staying with you for a few months. Hopefully LEO's on the ground will be able to ascertain the difference in choosing to help people regain access to a property.

In the latter case, if someone is legitimately living somewhere, they have rights and cannot be summarily evicted via self help. Even without a written lease (an oral lease instead), there are still statutory protections for tenants. Even if they weren't paying rent, the courts will probably assume some other reason for you permitting to stay in your house for months (do they do the dishes or take care of the kids?).

To flip your homeless person situation around, if someone was permitted to summarily evict by self help a tenant with an oral lease simply by saying, "I want him gone, he's not allowed here anymore, and he never paid me to live here" then how would the law provide any protection at all for people that have oral leases?
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#28
Old 12-26-2008, 01:42 AM
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Originally Posted by SandyHook View Post
An ex sister in law was living in Las Vegas with some guy. They had a falling out and she wanted him out of the apartment. They had been living together for a year or so. During that time he never worked and she did. She paid all the bills, the place was in her name, etc.

When she called the cops to get him thrown out they said (according to her), "If his clothes are here then he lives here and we can't throw him out."

She did finally get rid of him and moved back east.

This wasn't all that long ago, perhaps 2 years.
But if he really had no legal right to be there and she was able to kick him out he would have no legal recourse. He can't sue her (successfully) for wrongful eviction. He can't complain that she did not comply with the notice requirements. The first step in establishing a case is that the person had a right to be there in the first place.

The OP did not ask what the cops would do. Of course many of them will not get involved in domestic squables. I wish people would stop bringing in anecdotes about how cops acted. The question is about the legality of a parent kicking a child out of his house when that child turned 18. Not how the cops will handle a domestic situation.

Absent some cite which no one has provided there is no basis in AMERICAN property law that I know of that allows one to remain in the home of another absent a lawful claim of right or contract. Sure the police may not want to get involved but that has no bearing on the right of the parent to kick a kid out. Practically speaking you may need to take legal action or get a court order but if the parent says get out and the kid does he cannot then turn around and claim damages because the parents failed to comply with landlord/tenant eviction law.
#29
Old 12-26-2008, 01:52 AM
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Originally Posted by askeptic View Post
Absent some cite which no one has provided there is no basis in AMERICAN property law that I know of that allows one to remain in the home of another absent a lawful claim of right or contract.
Correct. And the kid has a lawful claim until they are served notice to leave.
#30
Old 12-26-2008, 02:09 AM
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Originally Posted by IAmNotSpartacus View Post
And the kid has a lawful claim until they are served notice to leave.
That is incorrect.

ETA: Well he may have a claim but not one that requires the parents to comply with any notice requirement. They can say be out right now if they want to.

Last edited by askeptic; 12-26-2008 at 02:11 AM.
#31
Old 12-26-2008, 05:01 AM
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Originally Posted by Shagnasty View Post
Per cite. This one isn't hard. There is case law on this and we have talked about it here many times before. A Japanese exchange student, Yoshihiro Hattori, was shot dead in Baton Rouge in 1992 by a homeowner when he went to the wrong address for a Halloween party and refused to comply with the order to leave. Louisiana law allows lethal defense for protection of both people and property. There was a language barrier and the event was extremely unfortunate but the homeowner was still acquitted. It was an international media case but the law still found in favor of the homeowner.
How this has shit to do with the question being asked is anyone's guess.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SandyHook
An ex sister in law was living in Las Vegas with some guy. They had a falling out and she wanted him out of the apartment. They had been living together for a year or so. During that time he never worked and she did. She paid all the bills, the place was in her name, etc.

When she called the cops to get him thrown out they said (according to her), "If his clothes are here then he lives here and we can't throw him out."
That is what I have *always* understood and that is what I have always heard happen and what I have *always* seen on Cops. The notion that you would have someone tresspassing on your property and the cops just "don't want to get involved" is just plain silly.

If a person has been living in a place for a while and considers that place to be their residence you cannot kick them out without due process. It doesn't matter if they are squatters, you try to take matters into your own hands and you are in trouble.

My guess is that pretty much in every state (maybe with the exception of Texas because they are always weird) you cannot evict your children or anyone else living in the property without due notice. If someone has been living with you as a guest, not paying anything, for quite a while, you cannot evict them without notice.

IAmNotSpartacus's link supports that.
#32
Old 12-26-2008, 12:05 PM
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Shangnasty,

Your examples of 'shoot to kill', in no instance, apply to any person who has lawfully slept overnight at said residence.
#33
Old 12-26-2008, 01:23 PM
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Originally Posted by Mr. Slant View Post
Shangnasty,

Your examples of 'shoot to kill', in no instance, apply to any person who has lawfully slept overnight at said residence.
That seems obvious but is it really? This whole thread is about ridiculous hypotheticals. I didn't want to make that a major point but I was asked for a valid cite and gave it. That type of thing has happened in real life but I have never heard of zombie, adult, teenagers taking over a house and refusing to leave yet the homeowners are powerless to do something about it without getting legal counsel and court orders.

People keep making the claim this is true but no one gave any real evidence for it. The reason I gave the shoot to kill trespassing cites for Louisiana is that it my be theoretically easier just to shoot your 18 year old after he/she refuses to stop trying to open your front door or climb in your windows for the umpteenth time rather than worry about going to court over it. All you should have to do is lock the front door the first time the person leaves the house.

Again, that example was meant to be extreme but I gave more evidence for it than those that say you could easily end up with adults in your house that you don't want to be there and have no control over. If there are laws that allow these types of people free access to your own home, what are they supposedly allowed to do once they are in? Apparently most anything according to people in this thread because you have no recourse to kick them out right away. That sounds ridiculous.

Last edited by Shagnasty; 12-26-2008 at 01:26 PM.
#34
Old 12-26-2008, 01:26 PM
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So what happens when you forcefully throw/drag the squatter out of your house (or lock the door behind him when he goes out for a smoke), the cops knock on the door and ask you to let him back in after listening to his sob-story, and you simply refuse/lock the door/and order him to get off your property regardless? Are they gonna kick your door down, cuff you, and let the scumbag roam freely through your house ransacking it/molesting your kids while driving you to the station, just based on his word?

If they won't forcefully remove a person on the spot without legal process, I can't see how they'd forcefully implant a person in someone else's house without the same legal process. So once the freeloader is out, what happens if the homeowner simply refuses them re-entry?
#35
Old 12-26-2008, 01:53 PM
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Originally Posted by Shagnasty View Post
People keep making the claim this is true but no one gave any real evidence for it.
What would appear to be the law in Louisiana has been presented for you. How that qualifies as a lack of real evidence is beyond me. Do you require multiple Gfactor-esque case-law cites to refute your suppositions and assumptions?

Better yet, make it easy for us all, and provide a cite to support your position.

ETA: And even better yet, provide a cite that is applicable to OP's question that also supports your position.

Last edited by IAmNotSpartacus; 12-26-2008 at 01:54 PM.
#36
Old 12-26-2008, 02:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shagnasty View Post
That seems obvious but is it really? This whole thread is about ridiculous hypotheticals.
No, this thread is about whether the parents can kick out of the house their adult children without warning and the answer is that in general terms you cannot kick anyone out of their residence, children or not, without due notice.
Quote:
I didn't want to make that a major point but I was asked for a valid cite and gave it.
No, you gave a cite of something which has Jack Shit to do with what is being discussed.

The Louisana Code of Civil Procedure Section 4702 has been cited and I bet that is the law pretty much everywhere.

Ask anyone who has wanted to get rid of room mates. It does not matter that their names are not on the lease; if they live there you cannot kick them out without notice. It does not matter that they not pay rent, nothing matters except that you cannot kick someone out of their residence without notice.

I can tell you that is how it is in Washington DC because I have seen one such case where the police were called and said to the owner that if the guy who wanted to enter was residing there then he had the right to enter. While it was not said openly, it was clear from the context that the owner of the property *would* be arrested if he tried to prevent it.

I have no doubt that is how it is in pretty much every state and every developed country. You cannot take the law into your own hands and kick someone out of their residence. You need to give them notice and if they refuse then you need to go to court.
#37
Old 12-26-2008, 02:35 PM
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Thank you!
#38
Old 12-26-2008, 02:39 PM
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Evicting a family member
Quote:
http://expertlaw.com/forums/showthread.php?p=213348

It doesn't matter that he never paid a dime in his life or signed a lease - if that's where he's living, keeping his stuff, getting mail, he has a key, etc. - then the law is going to consider that his place of residence and therefore he has automatic rights. It would be the same if you let some stranger move into your place for a while (we see that scenario here all the time too) - once they're in and established, they're your tenant, you're their landlord, and the way to get them out is to follow the eviction process.
In other words, "tenant" does not mean "paying rent" but "in possession". It does not matter if he did not have a lease or paid rent. If he lived there he was a "tenant" and due process needs to be followed for eviction. Not following due process would subject the party causing the eviction to civil liability and maybe criminal if force was used.

Last edited by sailor; 12-26-2008 at 02:39 PM.
#39
Old 12-26-2008, 03:31 PM
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Parents, just cover your basis and get the court ordered eviction before midnight that night. It would be the gift that keeps on giving all year.
#40
Old 12-26-2008, 03:43 PM
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how to go about removing my 19 year old son from my residence

how to go about removing my 19 year old son from my residence
Quote:
http://boards.answers.findlaw.com/n/...rsMB&tid=27745

Q - i'm wondering how to go about removing my 19 year old son from my residence legally. Is it the same as a lanlord eviction?

A - Yes, since your home is your son's residence, you are essentially his landlord and he is your tenant. If you ask him to leave and he refuses to go, you will have to evict him. [...]

A- You will have to give him 30 day notice.
#41
Old 12-26-2008, 03:47 PM
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Tables reversed

Son is owner of property and wants to evict abusive alcoholic father.
Quote:
http://en.allexperts.com/q/Dealing-R...ily-member.htm

because he has been living with you for years, this is the reason the police say he has a right to live there, he has what they consider "established residency".
#42
Old 12-26-2008, 07:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by askeptic View Post
involved but that has no bearing on the right of the parent to kick a kid out. Practically speaking you may need to take legal action or get a court order but if the parent says get out and the kid does he cannot then turn around and claim damages because the parents failed to comply with landlord/tenant eviction law.
My understanding is that is NOT so.

If you evict someone without following the process you can get in big trouble both with the law (criminal) AND the person inproperly evicted (civil big money lawsuit).

So, while throwing all their stuff on the lawn and locking the door while they are gone could be quite satisfying, its the kind of thing that makes some lawyers drool at the dollar signs.
#43
Old 12-26-2008, 09:46 PM
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So just give your no good rotten offspring written notice to vacate 30 days before his/her 18th birthday.Maybe you will get lucky and they will leave early.
#44
Old 12-27-2008, 07:26 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mmmiiikkkeee View Post
So what happens when you forcefully throw/drag the squatter out of your house (or lock the door behind him when he goes out for a smoke), the cops knock on the door and ask you to let him back in after listening to his sob-story, and you simply refuse/lock the door/and order him to get off your property regardless? Are they gonna kick your door down, cuff you, and let the scumbag roam freely through your house ransacking it/molesting your kids while driving you to the station, just based on his word?

If they won't forcefully remove a person on the spot without legal process, I can't see how they'd forcefully implant a person in someone else's house without the same legal process. So once the freeloader is out, what happens if the homeowner simply refuses them re-entry?
What would the cops do if you came back to your home and found squatters had taken possession and changed the locks? Same thing.

Cops, besides having guns and nice cars, are also equipped with brains and a certain amount of training in how to handle specific situations. The law states that you cannot evict a person from his residence without notice. So the cops ask a few questions and determine the 18 year-old son is, in fact, residing there. Anyone trying to evict him is breaking the law and can be taken down to the station if he persists in breaking the law. So what if he is the owner of the house?

Shagnasty, has become very quiet in this thread...
#45
Old 12-27-2008, 12:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blalron View Post
Let's say the parents either despise the kid or feel the best "tough love" is to kick them out of the house the instant they turn 18.
Of course you can unless they are bigger than you or stronger or meaner. As stated, it is implied that this in not a spur of the moment decision. So, you should know the legal aspects of what you are going to do. Right? If the kid is smart enough to call the cops, they will get back in. If you can't make them so miserable that they don't leave within the hour, then you are not much of a parent IMO.

Quote:
Can they kick them out at the stroke of midnight on the 18th birthday, or do they have to serve some sort of "eviction notice" and give them time?
Of course they can. See above. Make it legal and binding? That takes more planning. Find out the legal requirements. Send notice, you collect mail, leave letter in the open with all the other bills, the kid will never open it. Have at least one extra day on hand so you can do the deed on the stroke of midnight or when ever for maximum effect, I like snow or rain falling myself. YMMV

Now this answers the question as asked. All the others tangents have been run off into the woods in all directions.

Summation:
Yes you can if you are big, strong nuff. Prolly won't last if the one kicked out brings in the law or one of the skanks known as a lawyer.

With proper planning, you can do it and have it stick even if they are bigger, stronger or get a lawyer to waste money on. Even on the stroke of midnight.
:: Now, back to the irrelevant tangents that are so much fun...
#46
Old 12-27-2008, 01:26 PM
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All this legal mumbo-jumbo may be interesting, but lets be real: how many teenagers are going to insist on staying after being told to leave? Truth is that in 99-44/100% of the time it is the teen that says they want to leave and in the remainder they will just say "f.... you" and leave. So there is little if any need to argue this point.
#47
Old 12-27-2008, 02:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sailor View Post
What would the cops do if you came back to your home and found squatters had taken possession and changed the locks? Same thing.

Cops, besides having guns and nice cars, are also equipped with brains and a certain amount of training in how to handle specific situations. The law states that you cannot evict a person from his residence without notice. So the cops ask a few questions and determine the 18 year-old son is, in fact, residing there. Anyone trying to evict him is breaking the law and can be taken down to the station if he persists in breaking the law. So what if he is the owner of the house?

Shagnasty, has become very quiet in this thread...
I think the core issue-residence vs visitor- has become clear to us all. Trespassing is against the law. Living in a specific place, whether one owns it or has an oral lease, provides that person some legal protections. Examples of trespassing do not apply to cases of eviction of a resident. Even in Louisiana, one can't shoot a resident of a dwelling just because said resident doesn't obey the orders of the property owner. Shagnasty has been discussing cases of trespassing. The OP posed a question about a resident. The confluence of the two threads are when a trespasser becomes a resident. I would be interested in hearing further discussion regarding when a T becomes an R. Being in possession of a key, perhaps (but we have keys to the neighbor's house in case of emergency-as they do of ours), receiving mail (I get mail at my office all the time. Doesn't mean I live there), I eat at restaurants so eating there isn't proof, sleeping ditto, some combination of the above-that may be the definition. We all can agree (I hope) that on the stroke of midnight the 18 yr old is still a resident of that house and enjoys certain protections under the law. A person climbing through the window and crashing on the sofa doesn't. But between these two extremes, what defines a resident?
#48
Old 12-27-2008, 02:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rbroome View Post
But between these two extremes, what defines a resident?
The term you're looking for is occupant.
#49
Old 12-27-2008, 03:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rbroome View Post
The confluence of the two threads are when a trespasser becomes a resident. I would be interested in hearing further discussion regarding when a T becomes an R. We all can agree (I hope) that on the stroke of midnight the 18 yr old is still a resident of that house and enjoys certain protections under the law. A person climbing through the window and crashing on the sofa doesn't. But between these two extremes, what defines a resident?
I agree, that is the crux of it.
#50
Old 12-27-2008, 03:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rbroome View Post
I think the core issue-residence vs visitor- has become clear to us all. Trespassing is against the law. Living in a specific place, whether one owns it or has an oral lease, provides that person some legal protections. Examples of trespassing do not apply to cases of eviction of a resident. Even in Louisiana, one can't shoot a resident of a dwelling just because said resident doesn't obey the orders of the property owner. Shagnasty has been discussing cases of trespassing. The OP posed a question about a resident. The confluence of the two threads are when a trespasser becomes a resident. I would be interested in hearing further discussion regarding when a T becomes an R. Being in possession of a key, perhaps (but we have keys to the neighbor's house in case of emergency-as they do of ours), receiving mail (I get mail at my office all the time. Doesn't mean I live there), I eat at restaurants so eating there isn't proof, sleeping ditto, some combination of the above-that may be the definition. We all can agree (I hope) that on the stroke of midnight the 18 yr old is still a resident of that house and enjoys certain protections under the law. A person climbing through the window and crashing on the sofa doesn't. But between these two extremes, what defines a resident?
Thanks,

That is what I was getting at.
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