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#1
Old 09-14-2006, 05:29 AM
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I was slammed for creating D&D plots that were enjoyable!

I remember when I was first DMing D&D. I was with my girlfriend and a few of her friends. I knew barely anything about the rules (compared to most DMs). I knew how to roll D20s and knew basic rules, but if you were going to, say, perform a Bull Rush, I'd had to spend a minute looking it up. I only DMed at all because I thought that it would be fun, it was a way of entertaining, of creating a world and letting people try to get through it.

Then I talked to Jamie...

Jamie Tachiyama is a friend of mine. He has been playing D&D for way, way too long. After I had DMed a few times, I called Jamie just to let him know that I had started DMing, and told him about a few of the games I had created. He started correcting me at every point. Not on issues about rules, or about enjoyment of the game, but about being realistic!

You see, my stories were all about the fun ideas that I had in my head. One story had the characters go into a spiraling tower with a wizard at the top that was way too powerful for the characters to combat. The only way to kill him was to use your bluff skill to convince the bodak to go upstairs and look at him, without letting him look at you. The players loved it, I mean, I got compliments for making a good game. But I got verbally castrated by my hardcore DnD friend for this one. Oh my God, why would a wizard have a Bodak as a friend!? And there's no way you can bluff a bodak! I mean, they're undead! Jesus! And why were the Dwarves smuffling precious metals - dwarves are upright and honorable!

I decided that I wasn't cut out to be a real DnD player.
#2
Old 09-14-2006, 06:05 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FrantzJ
And why were the Dwarves smuffling precious metals .
That's something D&D'ers don't like to talk about.
#3
Old 09-14-2006, 06:41 AM
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Originally Posted by TPWombat
That's something D&D'ers don't like to talk about.
Well, that and the steroid allegations against the various barbarian classes. 'Roid rage indeed.
#4
Old 09-14-2006, 06:52 AM
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God, I said smuffling? I meant "smuggling." Ouch.
#5
Old 09-14-2006, 07:02 AM
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Tell your friend (politely) to get stuffed. You had a good time. Your players had a good time. That's the point of any game. If he didn't like the way you did things, it's HIS problem, not yours.
#6
Old 09-14-2006, 07:12 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FrantzJ
Not on issues about rules, or about enjoyment of the game, but about being realistic!
If I want realism, I can just go to the office and compile reports for 8 hours. Wheeeeeee!

I'm also not quite getting the whole argument that your Wizard / Undead creature relationship isn't "realistic" enough. He does realize that this stuff is all made up, right?
#7
Old 09-14-2006, 07:19 AM
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Well, apparently the idea is that there is this DnD universe that I'm supposed to pay respect to. Apparently, having a wizard with a bodak as a pet would be like having Yoda live on Hoth, or something. It wouldn't "make sense".

'Cause, you know, having monsters that are amoeba-like blobs comprising of just mouths and eyes, which run around looking for other mouths and eyes to eat, really makes sense.

Admit it, you know what monster I just described.
#8
Old 09-14-2006, 07:25 AM
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Eh, I just house rule everything that I feel like. The rules are there to provide structure to combat. That's it. My creatures' behavior and abilities may or may not match the rulebook. I don't want a player who's read the Monsters Manuals to know every single attack and strategy of every opponent; their character wouldn't know that, anyway, so in order to provide real surprise I can't just present them with a standard monster.

Alignment categorization is something I nearly *always* change. I really hate the alignment system. Sure, a creature may be Lawful Good in his own mind, but that doesn't mean he won't kill you if you get in the way of his attempts to make things right. Saying "dwarves are good, therefore they would never do anything I interpret as wrong" is silly. They are a different culture. Likewise I allow some flexibility; I don't institute alignment penalties (except for priests who violate the tenets of their god in a major way). I have one player in my campaign whose character harbors major grudges because of being enslaved. He hates authority and will torture and destroy to do what he thinks is right and good. Yet, he is kind to children and the poor, and will stop to help anyone in need. What alignment is he?

But then again I place all my campaigns in non-standard worlds so I can interpret things however I like. It's never been a problem for anyone who actually plays to have fun and not some sense of "winning the game".
#9
Old 09-14-2006, 09:45 AM
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The next time your friend complains, just ask him outside for a bit of Calvinball.

Some peoples is just too uptight.
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#10
Old 09-14-2006, 10:03 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FrantzJ
Admit it, you know what monster I just described.
Gibbering Mouther, was it not?
#11
Old 09-14-2006, 10:08 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hypno-Toad
Tell your friend (politely) to get stuffed.
Don't you mean "smuffed"?
#12
Old 09-14-2006, 10:14 AM
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My SO is the DM in our circle of friends, and he is just like you - makes his own rules for everything, and even customizes the monsters to his needs. I say screw the rules and have a good time.

I once bought a D&D manual from the local store. Along with it I bought som e paints for my miniatures. Now I don't play with the miniatures, merely paint them, but someone stopped me and in the most snooty tone, said "Those don't go together." I shook my head, and simply told him I wasn't putting them together. Who cares, anyway?
#13
Old 09-14-2006, 10:14 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cheesesteak
If I want realism, I can just go to the office and compile reports for 8 hours. Wheeeeeee!

I'm also not quite getting the whole argument that your Wizard / Undead creature relationship isn't "realistic" enough. He does realize that this stuff is all made up, right?
We should invent a role playing game that is basically going to the office every day. Like you get personal ratings for things like Computer Efficiency, Meeting Deadlines, Accuracy, Orderliness, EXCEL Proficiency, PowerPoint Proficiency, Butt Kissing. Your battles are with Audits, IT, Vendors, etc.
#14
Old 09-14-2006, 10:20 AM
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Clearly your friend knows what he is talking about. The most realistic solution would be to befriend a Svirfneblin (sp?) and take him to the outer planes where you can attempt to sneak up and subdue a Rakshasa. Having charmed the Rakshasa and convincing it that the wizard is your most dangerous enemy (not counting the Rakshasa once the charm wears off), return to the material plane to confront the Wizard*.

Wizard and a bodak? What were you thinking?




*I did this for memory. I miss playing...
#15
Old 09-14-2006, 10:22 AM
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The job of the GM is to tell a story. The job of the players is to help by playing some of the characters in the story.

You use a game system or a campaign setting for two reasons: to give you a set of guidelines for stuff you don't know how it works (like disarming traps, casting spells, balancing your checkbook...), and to keep things consistent from game to game. If there's something in the game system that works differently from the way you want it to, and you can change it without making the game system inconsistent, go ahead and change it. If there's a rule that you think is inconsistent and you can change it without confusing the issue as to how stuff works, change it.

Sounds like you did fine.
#16
Old 09-14-2006, 10:23 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FrantzJ
'Cause, you know, having monsters that are amoeba-like blobs comprising of just mouths and eyes, which run around looking for other mouths and eyes to eat, really makes sense.

Admit it, you know what monster I just described.
Which one, Beholders? Lurking Stranglers? Mimics? Gibbering Mouthers? Gibbering Orbs?

*hangs his head in shame*
#17
Old 09-14-2006, 12:21 PM
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Ignore him. He's an idiot. If your players enjoy the campaign, and you don't want to kill them at the end of it, then you're doing just fine.
#18
Old 09-14-2006, 12:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ethilrist
The job of the GM is to tell a story. The job of the players is to help by playing some of the characters in the story.
Actually, I don't see it that way exactly. It's the job of everyone to tell the story together, and a great DM is one who is willing to let his ideas for the story go if the players have something equally cool come along.

A couple years ago I was privileged to play at a convention with a guy who got some sort of RPGA Judge of the Year award before they stopped giving that out. This guy's games are legendary--and for good reason. We all had an absolute blast. (His one published adventure, Of Sound Mind, is also my favorite module to run).

When I played, I watched him carefully for things I could take home with me. And the main lesson I learned from him can be summed up in one word:

Yes.

When a player tries something out, it's the DM's job to try to find a way to make it at least partially successful--or give it a chance of success. The more your DM says, "You can't do that," the less fun you're going to have.

This doesn't mean that everything is going to work. If I say, "I'm going to throw my toothpick at the evil wizard and hope it pierces his eyeball and kills him," then the DM doesn't need to give it much of a chance (unless, of course, your character has some sort of toothpick-accuracy schtick). But if someone says, "I'm a pretty tough guy, so on my turn, I'm going to leap from the hood of the car I'm on to the next car over and then see if I can shove a grenade through their window," the DM's job is to come up with a way to make this action plausible within the rules, and hopefully give the character a good chance of success.

Because the more the DM says yes, the more the players feel like it's their game, and the more elation they feel when their madcap zany shenanigans save the day.

How do you keep the game a challenge? Easy: when the evil NPCs ask if they can do something, you also say yes.

Daniel
#19
Old 09-14-2006, 01:39 PM
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D&D and similar games can be played in different ways to appeal people (kinda like different people want different things out of a novel or a movie or a video game). Some are in it for the role-playing, others for the combat, others for the cleverness (finding clever ways of avoiding traps and overcoming obstacles), others for the exploration. Some are sticklers for the rules of the game or plausibility or internal consistency because it makes things more fun; for others, scrupulous attention to such things gets in the way of their fun.

If you're giving your players what they want, then you're doing a good job. Case closed.
#20
Old 09-14-2006, 02:08 PM
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Great post, LHoD.

You did fine, FrantzJ. If everyone had fun, that's all that matters.
#21
Old 09-14-2006, 05:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lokij
Which one, Beholders? Lurking Stranglers? Mimics? Gibbering Mouthers? Gibbering Orbs?

*hangs his head in shame*
Don't feel bad - my first guess was the Otyugh. I don't even think they have eyes. Shows how long it's been since I've played.
#22
Old 09-14-2006, 05:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Left Hand of Dorkness
A couple years ago I was privileged to play at a convention with a guy who got some sort of RPGA Judge of the Year award before they stopped giving that out. This guy's games are legendary--and for good reason. We all had an absolute blast. (His one published adventure, Of Sound Mind, is also my favorite module to run).

When I played, I watched him carefully for things I could take home with me. And the main lesson I learned from him can be summed up in one word:

Yes.

When a player tries something out, it's the DM's job to try to find a way to make it at least partially successful--or give it a chance of success. The more your DM says, "You can't do that," the less fun you're going to have.
I'm going to have to print this post out and show it to my GM. He's really good at running adventures, but he's also a teacher and football coach, and he tends to get stuck thinking of the GM as a referee keeping the players in line. There was one time, during a long-running campaign, where a wizard offered to sell us new magic weapons, as the ones we had were no longer powerful enough for our level. Everyone else in the party planned to sell their old weapons to get a better price, effectively meaning that they only had to pay the difference in cost between their old weapons and their new ones. My character's sword was an heirloom of his royal family, of which he was the last surviving member. I didn't want to get rid of it, so I asked if, instead of selling it and buying a new one, I could just have the enchantments already on it strengthened. The GM said no, but I could have an all new sword that did everything my old one did, plus whatever extra powers I could afford to have the wizard add to it. For exactly the same price I would have paid for improving my old sword. In terms of the game system, it would make absolutely no difference: I'd have a sword with exactly the same bonuses, for exactly the same amount of gold. It just couldn't be the sword that was tied into my entire character's background. An entirely arbitrary refusal, based simply on the fact that I wanted to roleplay how I got the sword differently than the way he'd envisioned it. And he wasn't doing it to be a dick, he's just got the mindset that the GM is there to limit the players, not enable them.

As for the OP, your friend is a loser. Don't listen to what he says. All that matters is that the people at the table with you had a good time.
#23
Old 09-14-2006, 05:29 PM
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In the eighties, when I played D&D, there was a girl who played with us once. The adventurers were out somewhere, going from A to B, when she suddenly says: "I found a chest with gold!" And she's very happy about it too.
The DM was a bit startled, said: "No, you didn't."
She's happy as ever: "Yes I did!" And however the DM tried to convince her that she did not, she wouldn't buy it, and she was totally honest and sincere.

Now, she was'nt cut out to play D&D, I tell you...
#24
Old 09-14-2006, 05:41 PM
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No, this girl is someone who is not cut out for role-playing.
#25
Old 09-14-2006, 06:07 PM
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To those who guessed: it is a gibbering mouther.
#26
Old 09-14-2006, 06:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KidScruffy
Don't feel bad - my first guess was the Otyugh. I don't even think they have eyes. Shows how long it's been since I've played.

OTTOMH Otyughs have two eyes on the end of a long single tendril.

Back To The OP

There are bad dwarves. Wizards have all kinds of weird friends. Being undead doesn't affect your ability to detect a bluff (unless we're dealing with uninteligent undead.) Even if you do break with the description for a thing, it only matters if it's something that the characters (not the players) would know.

I think a DM does need to limit players in some way. Munchkins must be restrained. One player shouldn't take over the campaign and monopolize the DM. Characters do not have player knowledge. But players should be encouraged to find resourceful ways to things.

A friend was playing a cleric who had taken an extreme vow of poverty. The rest of the group was killed by a band of mercenaries. They were trying to figure out who the cleric was, and if he had anything of value. He held out his begging bowl and said "Alms for a poor leper?". The mercenaries left.
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#27
Old 09-14-2006, 07:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ethilrist
You use a game system or a campaign setting for two reasons: to give you a set of guidelines for stuff you don't know how it works (like disarming traps, casting spells, balancing your checkbook...),
If only D&D could teach me to balance the damn checkbook. Sigh.

I smite thee, checkbook register!

Damn. Rolled a 1.
#28
Old 09-14-2006, 07:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FilmGeek
If only D&D could teach me to balance the damn checkbook. Sigh.

I smite thee, checkbook register!

Damn. Rolled a 1.
You approach a bounced check fee of accountability. Roll Initiative...
#29
Old 09-14-2006, 09:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Miller
No, this girl is someone who is not cut out for role-playing.
Strangely enough, I played in a game with a character just like this, and it was a blast.

That is, the character was just like the girl in the purple shirt. It was a one-shot con game called "Underoo Avengers," and the characters were all childhood stereotypes--the brainiac nerd (guess who got to play him!), the sports-jock (a British import who specialized in cricket), the bully, and the girl who loved unicorns. Everyone had commensurate powers, and among her powers were to create a Princess Bubble that protected her from anything icky, and to summon a herd of purple unicorns that stampeded the bad guys.

It was a fantastic con game.

Daniel
#30
Old 09-15-2006, 04:32 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Left Hand of Dorkness
When I played, I watched him carefully for things I could take home with me. And the main lesson I learned from him can be summed up in one word:

Yes.
And adding some varity to the NPCs. Like a halfling armed with a half-brick in a sock that had a Lesser Death Rune embroidered on it.

And figuring out how to deal with the fallout when someones favourite character becomes addicted to Black Lotus during a long boat voyage and, after his 'friends' decide to sell him all their stashes in exchange for his possessions, a (very) long series of willpower and effects rolls leaves his alter ego butt-naked, unarmed, broke, and with half-a-dozen insanities including an irrational terror of wheels. At the start of a 36-hour gaming session. That was a very fun weekend
#31
Old 09-15-2006, 09:27 AM
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All D&D plots should be enjoyable. Sensible is an option. The group I used to game with devised a pack of special "Plot cards" to liven things up.

On one occasion a party of characters were infiltrating a large castle in order to duke it out with some arch-nasty. They cleverly disguised themselves as castle underlings and hid all their armour, weapons and magic items in a laundry hamper. Cunning stuff. Thus enabled, they bypassed all the lesser guards and so on until they finally burst into the tyrant's chamber and bid him prepare to meet his fate, and whipped off the lid of the laundry hamper...

**Plot card bearing the word Setback hits the table**

...to find that it contains... laundry. (And then we have a flashback to an earlier off-camera moment where there was a momentary traffic blockage as they went through the castle laundry, and they realize how the accidental substitution happened.)

Approximately ten minutes later, the scene continued.
#32
Old 09-15-2006, 09:58 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gangster Octopus
We should invent a role playing game that is basically going to the office every day. Like you get personal ratings for things like Computer Efficiency, Meeting Deadlines, Accuracy, Orderliness, EXCEL Proficiency, PowerPoint Proficiency, Butt Kissing. Your battles are with Audits, IT, Vendors, etc.
Look for John Morressey's short story "Executives and Elevators."
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#33
Old 09-15-2006, 10:43 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FrantzJ
You see, my stories were all about the fun ideas that I had in my head. One story had the characters go into a spiraling tower with a wizard at the top that was way too powerful for the characters to combat. The only way to kill him was to use your bluff skill to convince the bodak to go upstairs and look at him, without letting him look at you.
You want to really piss other DMs off?

Play the same scenario.

Remove the Bodak.

That's the way it would go in my campaign - you can't beat the wizard? You make friends, you boot it out of there before joining combat, you boot it out of there AFTER joining combat and pray like a mofo, or you start rolling up new characters.

My players love it.

A lot of other DMs hate it.
#34
Old 09-15-2006, 10:53 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bobotheoptimist
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hypno-Toad
Tell your friend (politely) to get stuffed.
Don't you mean "smuffed"?
Stugged, I think.
#35
Old 09-15-2006, 11:13 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fluiddruid
I have one player in my campaign whose character harbors major grudges because of being enslaved. He hates authority and will torture and destroy to do what he thinks is right and good. Yet, he is kind to children and the poor, and will stop to help anyone in need. What alignment is he?
Chaotic Neutral.

As to the OP and the need for realism in the game, I'm reminded of the "Calvin and Hobbes" cartoon.

Calvin: Maybe Batman could just write a letter to the editor, or something.

Hobbes: Quick! To the Batfax!
#36
Old 09-15-2006, 11:23 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FrantzJ
... But I got verbally castrated by my hardcore DnD friend for this one. Oh my God, why would a wizard have a Bodak as a friend!? And there's no way you can bluff a bodak! I mean, they're undead! Jesus! And why were the Dwarves smuffling precious metals - dwarves are upright and honorable!

I decided that I wasn't cut out to be a real DnD player.
Sure, you're cut out to be a real DnD player (of genius). You just need a plan and a little help.

1. Ask your hardcore DnD friend to please GM a game for you, so that you can see how you should be doing things by the book.

2. Choose Pun Pun the Kobold to play as your character.

3. At the first time hardcore DnD friend objects, take the moral victory as you point out that Pun Pun is how you're supposed to play DnD. By the book.

Then tell him to lighten up, and go get a beer or something. Because, dayum.
#37
Old 09-15-2006, 11:24 AM
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Your friend should have a look at the precurser D&D materials. the OLD ones with critters like "Kill Kittens" and "Zoomers." The very heart of the game is and always has been "fun" not pedantic adherence to roolz. How realistic can you be when you're looking for the legendary vines of the canteloupes of flame strike?
#38
Old 09-15-2006, 08:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RealityChuck
Look for John Morressey's short story "Executives and Elevators."
Thanks a lot. As a huge fan of John Morressey (damn shame about his death) I now have to go try and track down a copy of the January 1984 F&SF. I hope you're happy.

Seriously, I realize more and more how much of his stuff I've never read. I guess I'll spend some time online looking for all this old stuff.

Back on topic, I've never really played much D&D except for CRPGs. That said, some of my favorite modules made for NWN were the ones that gave a twist to what could be done with the ruleset.
#39
Old 09-15-2006, 08:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by asterion
CRPGs. That said, some of my favorite modules made for NWN were the ones that gave a twist to what could be done with the ruleset.
I have yet to find a CRPG which allows for the following.

Player(playing a giant prayin mantis)- I distract the guard
DM-How?
Player-[waves arms and makes bizzare loud noises]
DM-The guard is distracted.
#40
Old 09-15-2006, 09:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FrantzJ
Well, apparently the idea is that there is this DnD universe that I'm supposed to pay respect to. Apparently, having a wizard with a bodak as a pet would be like having Yoda live on Hoth, or something. It wouldn't "make sense".

'Cause, you know, having monsters that are amoeba-like blobs comprising of just mouths and eyes, which run around looking for other mouths and eyes to eat, really makes sense.

Admit it, you know what monster I just described.
If you're referring to gibbering mouthers, then they're blood drinkers. There are a few other abberations that eat eyes, but none that eat mouths and eyes (unless you're referring to a Defacer, which has more than eyes and mouths).


As for the pedantic player:
It is in fact unrealistic for a wizard to have a pet bodak, because neither bodaks nor wizards exist in reality. Given that, no claims about their relative realism can be made. It sounds as if this player is terminally unable to cope with the concept of creatures that don't follow his preconcieved notions of them.

As mentioned, Pun-Pun is an excellent cure for this type of 'thinker'.


Also, as a DM myself, I can say that by deliberately not limiting the players, you can get much more interesting campaigns. As has been said, it is always your responsibility to, when a player tries to do something, figure out how it can be done.

A side-effect of this is to give up entirely on plotting adventures in advance. I just make a list of the notable NPCs acting in a current time frame, and what their goals are.

It makes things very interesting when, for instance, the werewolf the party was hired to kill is given his own bounty as a down-payment on a mercenary contract to join the party and unleash lycanthropic hell on a nearby tribe of orcs.

You can also get some wonderfully amusing PC actions when the players know that they can do anything, and you can do anything to them. One BBEG expected a break-in by the heroes at one of his facilities, so he made sure to put an extensive collection of forged evidence claiming that the current PC quest-giver was responsible for all of the war and unpleasantness in recent campaign history, and to be very careful about the evidence because if the quest-giver knew it existed, he'd give up on his current subtle plans and go back to the wanton slaughter, which the BBEG was piously trying to avoid. All a load of bull, but the BBEG was demonstrating that BAB and Str modifier do not an effective villain make.

You can guess how the party reacted when they discovered this 'plot twist'.
#41
Old 09-15-2006, 09:48 PM
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FrantzJ: I've been playing since 1975 in 6th grade. I started with the ancient 3 small books. I have Ref'd most of the time. Some of my campaigns were huge epics, with breathtaking detail and some were Monty Hall Affairs that played to the Players. A good DM should make the game fun, be fairly consistent to the rules he has established but those rules are up to the DM and the players. I only play rarely the last 9 years or so. (Since my first child was born), but I have run the current campaign for 5 years and the players want to keep going. I told them I was going to bring it to a conclusion this winter and we would start something new.
I am still using AD&D first edition and my own hand crafted world and my own rules. They have really enjoyed it, but they are now too powerful for me to get any satisfaction out of the game.

So keep DM'ing if the players have fun, you are doing a good job. If you ever get a campaign that appears book worthy, you have done a great job. I love the fact that people who use to play still talk about the old campaigns. It makes me feel good that I succeeded. Rulebooks are a guide, not a straight jacket!

Jim
#42
Old 09-15-2006, 11:36 PM
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Join Date: Oct 1999
Location: I'm coming back, now.
Posts: 7,419
There are always people who are playing a dice game, or a board game, or in fact trying to win a game. Then there are people who can enjoy a game where their fantasy character decides to ignore the fact that he rolled an 18 for strength, and play a magician. Why? because "He always wanted to be a magician."

I played in the "Freeport Campaign" for about seven years or so, a very long time ago. From the first, I knew it would be a different sort of game. My first character had "Animal Trainer" as an original skill. I saw no animals. I asked each time we entered a new area, what sort of animals were around. No animals. After a whole week of game time I had not seen a single animal, and the bulk or our adventure was out of doors. I finally found a duck. "I grab the duck!" I said. I had failed to ask if the duck was large, small or in any way odd. Turns out the duck was wearing a gi. He killed me. He killed me in an offhand manner. Seven years later,
my character, Triskadecamus set into motion the events that killed the entire race of the Drow, and then slew Death himself.

Making up an entire mythos, becoming heroes, and then acting like heroes is fun. Rolling dice, and counting up squares of a game board is boring.

And years later, no one remembers the ability scores, or the 'to hit' score rolled when Bloodstone said, "I punt the Brownie, and yell "'Pull!'" No one recalls why the character named "The Heart of Darkness" was able to fill the world with his darkness, or even exactly who the character was who used the party's Wish scroll, so that "I wish we could sacrifice our souls, to light a light that would shine forever, even in The Heart of Darkness."

Fantasy gaming is about fantastic things, not inches of map space, or random die rolls. The referee who said it best, when a board gamer showed him the "Monster Manual" said, "Yes, I am familiar with that book of suggestions. Nonetheless, Aprian, the King of Dragons, holds you motionless in his gaze, by sheer force of personality. Anyone want to risk his life to save this asshole?"

Triskadecamus
(who was once upon a time, the thirteenth lineal descendant of the Prime Magician, who invented magic.)
#43
Old 09-16-2006, 08:02 AM
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Join Date: Jul 2000
Location: Philladelphia-Mummer city
Posts: 11,681
Quote:
Originally Posted by Triskadecamus
Triskadecamus set into motion the events that killed the entire race of the Drow, and then slew Death himself.
You used the Kim Chee- Potion Of Unspeakable Foulness, didn't you?
#44
Old 09-16-2006, 08:48 PM
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Join Date: Oct 1999
Location: I'm coming back, now.
Posts: 7,419
Quote:
Originally Posted by DocCathode
You used the Kim Chee- Potion Of Unspeakable Foulness, didn't you?
You besmirch my honor, poltroon. I used plain old ordinary magic, and imagination. The kimche was just an horsdou. . . snack.

Tris
#45
Old 09-17-2006, 08:55 PM
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Join Date: Mar 2000
Posts: 10,513
Logical RP games are so boring. A good DM need s sence of humor and a creative mind. And then it's the players duty to really screw with them. I remeber the discussions about whether a thrown halfling counts as a projectile, blunt, or siege attack(I once killed a demon by critically hitting him in the groin with an accidentally tossed halfling name peehead). Whether an attacking swarm of trained herring should have an attack from behind. (it did) etc.
#46
Old 09-17-2006, 09:41 PM
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Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 1,980
I remember the game shop at the mall where we used to play because it was the easiest place for everyone to get to, and we didn't have a consistent campaign because not every player could make it to every game. there was a core group of about 5, and our best adventures were just screwball encounters we had into while travelling (ie wierd crap we made up as we went along.) we took turns DM'ing again because the same people weren't always there, and also to get different viewpoints.

one of them that I DM'ed was "The Kingdom of Haggis" which was technically about rescuing one of the other (absent player's) PCs from the demented prince of a distant kingdom, but really about undoing a curse on the kingdom that made all food instantly turn into haggis. I'm sure that would make your by-the-rules friend break out in hives, but we laughed our arses off for almost 5 hours that night.

memorable moments: gems like one girl's prissy elf warrior say, in a bad French accent, "all ma Brie 'as turn eento ze 'aggis!" or another guy daring to eat the haggis (I had him roll a constitution check, which came up 1. not only did he survive, but haggis became his very favorite food from then on!)

on the other hand, there was the new DM who put a sign up sheet in the shop and most of us signed up for it. a couple days later we got a phone call saying, meet me there at 6 and bring a first-level character. we showed up with our characters to find out that the campaign was seeking a major ring of elemental control (!) after fighting through a bunch of gorgons (with our 1st level characters, you do the math) and at one point he firestormed us because we were for some reason getting restless and non-cooperative, then graciously had our gods resurrect us to give us another chance to behave.

memorable moments....um.... does the point where my group made half-baked excuses about having to get home then going for pizza count?

oh yes, there was also a sphinx asking a riddle in that "campaign," and I did what any sensible panicked half-elf who didn't know the answer would: bluff like crazy. all you Pratchett geeks think of Teppic and the sphinx from Pyramids.

FrantzJ, I think I would have enjoyed playing in your game quite a bit, and what wizards and bodaks do in the privacy of their own towers is no one's business but their own
#47
Old 09-17-2006, 09:44 PM
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Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 1,980
Quote:
one girl's prissy elf warrior say, in a bad French accent
(cough) is it too late to add an ING
#48
Old 09-18-2006, 02:00 PM
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Join Date: May 2003
Location: Austin, TX
Posts: 3,145
The OP's DM buddy is full of haggis.

The DM is perfectly entitled to make up his (or her) own rules. He is effectively a supreme being. If the DM decides that the sky is green today and the ocean is comprised of chocolate syrup, so be it. If he thinks the dwarves should be 12 feet tall and the elves have no ears at all, so be it. The most important question is this: does the DM create a campaign that users want to play?

The gamer group I used to belong to had two members that were always playing rules lawyer. They spent their time between sessions coming up with outlandish uses for spells, weapons, magical items, whatnot, that were technically legal, but often violated the spirit of the game. Then, during game time, they would put these schemes into use, and argue with the DM for an hour if he tried to say no. As a result, their characters were low-level but insanely powerful (in gamer terminology, munchkins from hell), and would wipe out a whole army of foes before any of the other players had a chance to make a single attack roll. Those of us in the group who got sick of all this formed our own splinter cell and finally ditched the old group entirely.
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