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#1
Old 12-29-2017, 03:54 AM
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Black Mirror: Season 4 General Discussion (spoilers)

I wasn't even aware that they'd set a release date, but lo and behold I've just been notified that the season has just dropped on Netflix.

I'm just now watching the beginning of the first episode, "USS Callister", which appears to revolve around a VR Star Trek TOS homage.

Let's assume spoilers are fair game from this point forward.

Last edited by Smapti; 12-29-2017 at 03:56 AM.
#2
Old 12-29-2017, 04:37 AM
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Originally Posted by Smapti View Post
I wasn't even aware that they'd set a release date, but lo and behold I've just been notified that the season has just dropped on Netflix.

I'm just now watching the beginning of the first episode, "USS Callister", which appears to revolve around a VR Star Trek TOS homage.

Let's assume spoilers are fair game from this point forward.
Damn. I really need to catch up with this show. I was hooked the moment I watched the episode about social media and "likes'. That episode creeped me right the hell out.
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#3
Old 12-29-2017, 05:25 AM
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So, episode 1: "USS Callister".This is a double-length episode that, with commercials, would fill a 2-hour time slot on American TV. At its heart, this episode is really about two things which are sort of related. One, the quiet despair of the working-class bloke who's underappreciated by his bosses and doesn't know how to deal with his coworkers. Two, the hatred and toxic masculine revenge fantasies that have made themselves manifest in the age of Trump.

Daly created the entire VR game Callister Inc. has made its money on, but he feels like he's been cast aside by the money man who runs the company. He fantasizes about a world where he's in charge and all the people who've put him down have to answer to him instead. (Haven't we all?) The difference is, he has the power to put that plan into motion, and so he effectively kidnaps and mind-rapes all the people who've committed real or imaginary slights against him and turned them into his servants in a fantasy world where he's the one in charge. As harmless as he seems in the real world, he's undeniably a villain in the world he creates. Perhaps that's a commentary on how anyone can become evil if the social restraints on and consequences of their behavior are removed.

There were points where I thought they were going to go for the darkest possible ending and have him win in the end, but the VR versions of his coworkers managed to win out in the end even if by underhanded means (which opens up a whole side question about the morality of revenge porn and/or suicide.) The ending bit where it seems that the crew of the Callister have wound up on a typical EVE Online server was good for a chuckle.

It bothered me at times to hear some of the British actors attempting to imitate American accents, and with the mix of voices I wasn't sure whether this episode was supposed to be set in the US or the UK.

Stellar overall, and looking forward to watching the rest of the season over the next few days.

Last edited by Smapti; 12-29-2017 at 05:26 AM.
#4
Old 12-29-2017, 05:46 AM
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Originally Posted by FoieGrasIsEvil View Post
Damn. I really need to catch up with this show. I was hooked the moment I watched the episode about social media and "likes'. That episode creeped me right the hell out.
That is one of the least creepy ones, you are in for a treat.
#5
Old 12-29-2017, 06:44 PM
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Black Mirror season 4 discussion thread

So far I've seen 3 episodes, I'm watching a fourth right now.
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#6
Old 12-29-2017, 06:56 PM
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Binged all of it. Overall great. The last episode was pretty cool in there the museum had little bites from other episodes all throughout.
#7
Old 12-29-2017, 07:43 PM
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Existing thread.
#8
Old 12-29-2017, 08:01 PM
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I just watched episodes 1 and 2. Good stuff.

Someone told me that all season 4 episodes have female protagonists. Is this true?
#9
Old 12-29-2017, 08:25 PM
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Originally Posted by Smapti View Post
I missed that one. If a mod wants to combine these or close this go ahead.

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Originally Posted by monstro View Post
I just watched episodes 1 and 2. Good stuff.

Someone told me that all season 4 episodes have female protagonists. Is this true?
I've seen four episodes so far. Of them, three have a female protagonist but the fourth I saw had two main characters (male and female).
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#10
Old 12-29-2017, 08:47 PM
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Oh my fuck.

Ha ha.
#11
Old 12-29-2017, 10:36 PM
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Yeah got through ep one and started ep 2.

Also thought they'd go dark along the lines of the Harlan Ellison "I have no mouth and I must scream" short story and happy the good guys won this time but the basic themes seem to be getting rehashed here. Yeah yeah sentient avatars being tortured potentially forever. Again.

Even the first bit I saw of ep two calls back on the blocking out of what is not wanted to be seen by well intended parental control. I do hope they have more than the predictable ways for this to go wrong.
#12
Old 12-29-2017, 10:53 PM
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Originally Posted by DSeid View Post
Yeah yeah sentient avatars being tortured potentially forever. Again.
You may not want to watch the rest of the season then.
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#13
Old 12-30-2017, 01:45 AM
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Originally Posted by Smapti View Post
So, episode 1: "USS Callister".This is a double-length episode that, with commercials, would fill a 2-hour time slot on American TV. At its heart, this episode is really about two things which are sort of related. One, the quiet despair of the working-class bloke who's underappreciated by his bosses and doesn't know how to deal with his coworkers. Two, the hatred and toxic masculine revenge fantasies that have made themselves manifest in the age of Trump.
I think you are reading way too much into it with your last sentence there.

There's an episode of Star Trek: The Next Generation where a character called Barclay, who's a sad-sack incompetent crewman, creates Holodeck scenarios featuring himself as the hero and his colleagues as supporting characters. In his Holodeck, he somehow made it so that Riker was like a foot shorter than he was in reality, and I thought that part was particularly hilarious. This episode of Black Mirror reminded me of it.

In the game created by Todd (I will never be able to think of that actor, or any character he ever plays, as being named anything other than Todd), there isn't the slightest hint of sexuality, aggressive or otherwise. The characters literally have no genitals. This isn't "toxic masculinity", it's weird, asexual, "wholesomeness" - which makes it all the more bizarre, frankly.

Also, the guy isn't really a "working-class bloke", he's clearly doing pretty well for himself.
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#14
Old 12-30-2017, 01:50 AM
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Originally Posted by DSeid View Post
Also thought they'd go dark along the lines of the Harlan Ellison "I have no mouth and I must scream" short story and happy the good guys won this time but the basic themes seem to be getting rehashed here. Yeah yeah sentient avatars being tortured potentially forever. Again.
The IHNMAIMS / The Jaunt scenario is becoming a bit too much of a staple of Black Mirror. It packs an emotional punch, no doubt, but it is indeed being rehashed and rehashed and I hope the writers maybe lay off of it a little bit, because it's losing that emotional punch by being used too much as a plot device.
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#15
Old 12-30-2017, 04:35 AM
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Originally Posted by Jacquernagy View Post
In the game created by Todd (I will never be able to think of that actor, or any character he ever plays, as being named anything other than Todd), there isn't the slightest hint of sexuality, aggressive or otherwise. The characters literally have no genitals. This isn't "toxic masculinity", it's weird, asexual, "wholesomeness" - which makes it all the more bizarre, frankly.
Maybe it's not explicit, but it definitely felt like it was a paraphilia for him. His interest in the female lead (whose name I don't recall) definitely seemed to be sexual in nature, and it's very much a dominance fantasy he's acting out with these people.

Quote:
Also, the guy isn't really a "working-class bloke", he's clearly doing pretty well for himself.
Well, in a figurative sense if not literal. He definitely sees himself as being taken advantage of by people who are profiting off his blood, sweat, and tears.

Last edited by Smapti; 12-30-2017 at 04:35 AM.
#16
Old 12-30-2017, 05:49 AM
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Episode 2 - "Arkangel"

Jodie Foster directed this episode. Good job, Jodie! It's not as long as the season opener, but it's still long enough to fill a 90-minute timeslot on American TV.

I'm not a parent, and God willing, I never will be, so maybe I'm not the target demographic for this episode. The whole story revolves around one question; how far will you go to protect your child? Marie is obviously a very devoted mother who only wants the best for her child, but as Sara gets older, the things meant to protect her serve only to stunt her development instead. Thinking back to when I was young, if my parents had had the power to pixelate my sight and hearing to prevent me from seeing "adult" stuff, or had the power to see what I was seeing at any given moment, it'd have pissed me the hell off. In the end, it's Marie's over-protectiveness that drives Sara to madness, so I guess the moral of the story is not to keep your kids on too tight a leash, lest they not know how to handle themselves when they finally have to deal with adult shit on their own.

I liked the way they used makeup to gradually age Marie over the course of the episode, and how her client at the physical therapy clinic eventually becomes her steady as she grows older. The aging of Sara was also handled well, though the actress who plays her in third act definitely doesn't look the 15 that the script says she is. (Per Wikipedia, she's 21 in real life.) The mix of accents continued to bother me here. This episode is clearly meant to be set in a small town somewhere in the Midwest, yet we've got this range of American actors using their natural accents, British/Aussie actors faking American accents, British actors not bothering to hide it, and American actors seemingly trying to throw a bit of RP into their voice. A little more vocal consistency is all I'm asking for.

Aside; as a male, I've obviously never had a C-section, nor have I been in attendance for one. Is it really as painless for the mother as they made it look in the opening scene? I always imagined that having your belly cut open to pull a baby out of it would be an extremely painful and traumatic experience no matter how good the drugs you were on were.
#17
Old 12-30-2017, 09:35 AM
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Aside; as a male, I've obviously never had a C-section, nor have I been in attendance for one. Is it really as painless for the mother as they made it look in the opening scene? I always imagined that having your belly cut open to pull a baby out of it would be an extremely painful and traumatic experience no matter how good the drugs you were on were.

I’m a male, and so it’d maybe be jerkish of me to weigh in as a guy who’s only been in attendance for one — except, hey, all I did here was see the same episode you did, so why not shrug and mention what happened when I saw one in person?

And what I saw, then, was my wife on drugs so good that she could chat with the doctors while noting that what she felt wasn’t pain; she could feel something, she could feel pressure, but she was surprised that it wasn’t pain.

She was, though, more interested in talking about bubblegum, and jogging, and whether the tall and handsome guy standing next to her was the anesthesiologist. Spoiler alert: no, I wasn’t. Dang, those must have been good drugs.
#18
Old 12-30-2017, 11:05 AM
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Thinking back to when I was young, if my parents had had the power to pixelate my sight and hearing to prevent me from seeing "adult" stuff, or had the power to see what I was seeing at any given moment, it'd have pissed me the hell off.
Not particularly original. Neither was the first episode; I can cite stories going back at least 50 years for that trope.
#19
Old 12-30-2017, 01:58 PM
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#20
Old 12-30-2017, 03:42 PM
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You may not want to watch the rest of the season then.
Thanks for the heads up then. With that guidance it'll move down my queue. I'll finish Arkangel and then leave off for a bit.

Really though? They don't creatively come up with any other ideas than these few for how emerging technologies are going to ef us up? (Or minimally challenge our current ethical frameworks.)
#21
Old 12-30-2017, 04:50 PM
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Really though? They don't creatively come up with any other ideas than these few for how emerging technologies are going to ef us up? (Or minimally challenge our current ethical frameworks.)
That's pretty much Black Mirror's entire motif, yes.
#22
Old 12-30-2017, 05:15 PM
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Thanks for the heads up then. With that guidance it'll move down my queue. I'll finish Arkangel and then leave off for a bit.

Really though? They don't creatively come up with any other ideas than these few for how emerging technologies are going to ef us up? (Or minimally challenge our current ethical frameworks.)
Me and a bunch of other people came up with a variety of plot outlines Booker is free to use.

http://boards.academicpursuits.us/sdmb/...d.php?t=769963
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#23
Old 12-30-2017, 05:31 PM
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Originally Posted by DSeid View Post
Thanks for the heads up then. With that guidance it'll move down my queue. I'll finish Arkangel and then leave off for a bit.

Really though? They don't creatively come up with any other ideas than these few for how emerging technologies are going to ef us up? (Or minimally challenge our current ethical frameworks.)
It's an antidote to the relentless propaganda of tech companies, keenly supported by media.
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#24
Old 12-30-2017, 05:39 PM
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I wasn’t as blown away by this series as I have been in the past. Especially the first series. The technology just didn’t seem that interesting.

Of course I enjoyed all the episodes and love the idea of the show but didn’t see anything that would make me have to tell others “you gotta see this!”
#25
Old 12-30-2017, 06:46 PM
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Enjoyed this new season. One thing I found interesting is it wouldn't have been long ago the villain in the Trek Episode would have been portrayed as the hero. Put upon, picked on Genius who's unappreciated but has a crush on the New Girl. But here he is secretly a creep and a monster.

The Black and White episode was intense. I thought people would be grumbling when it was revealed all that effort was just for a teddy bear.

The last episode was basically an Anthology inside an Anthology like the Christmas episode. It felt like we had seen it before but I still enjoyed it.

The dating one was a rare happy ending for this show. I liked it. The leads had great chemistry.
#26
Old 12-30-2017, 07:01 PM
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I wasn’t as blown away by this series as I have been in the past. Especially the first series. The technology just didn’t seem that interesting.

Of course I enjoyed all the episodes

Well, look, it’s not like Cristin Milioti can be less than fantastic.
#27
Old 12-30-2017, 08:41 PM
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The dating one was a rare happy ending for this show. I liked it. The leads had great chemistry.
I didn't feel that way, I felt like it was about the cheapness of digital life. Your entire existence is just a simulation for someone else's benefit. To me about half the episodes in this new season, like DSeid says, are about tormenting digital conscious entities.
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Last edited by Wesley Clark; 12-30-2017 at 08:41 PM.
#28
Old 12-30-2017, 09:06 PM
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The Black and White episode was intense. I thought people would be grumbling when it was revealed all that effort was just for a teddy bear.
Well, I'm grumbling, because I thought it was fucking stupid.

That episode, and Crocodile, were the duds of the season, for me. In Crocodile it was like they were just barely trying to "Black-Mirror-ize" an uninteresting and formulaic story with a token technological spin.
#29
Old 12-30-2017, 10:13 PM
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Originally Posted by Jacquernagy View Post
In the game created by Todd (I will never be able to think of that actor, or any character he ever plays, as being named anything other than Todd), there isn't the slightest hint of sexuality, aggressive or otherwise. The characters literally have no genitals. This isn't "toxic masculinity", it's weird, asexual, "wholesomeness" - which makes it all the more bizarre, frankly.
As part of a revenge/power fantasy, he literally emasculated the men, and reduced the women's sexuality to what they could do for him (the kissing line), and you don't think this counts as toxic masculinity?
#30
Old 12-30-2017, 10:16 PM
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No, I don't think it counts, not as that term is commonly applied. The character was simply a sadist, in a way that was unrelated to gender or sexuality.
#31
Old 12-30-2017, 10:34 PM
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No, this is perfectly in line with toxic masculinity as it's commonly used.

Toxic masculinity includes the need to be dominant ('the alpha male'), the valuation of violence over non-violent resolution, the devaluation of women except as receptive sex objects, etc.

Are you perhaps confusing it with rape culture, which is related, but not the same thing.

Last edited by Kamino Neko; 12-30-2017 at 10:34 PM.
#32
Old 12-31-2017, 01:08 AM
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Those roach dog bot things were ka-reepy.

As for episode 1, another vote for not toxic masculinity. Just immature nerd revenge.
#33
Old 12-31-2017, 02:00 AM
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What, exactly, does toxic masculinity mean to you, if petty dominance displays, needlessly violent problem solving, and sexual assault (yes, the kissing line is sexual assault, even without genitals) aren't part of it? Because your definition is clearly very different from the usual one, which is summed up well in this article:

Quote:
Toxic masculinity is a specific model of manhood, geared toward dominance and control. It’s a manhood that views women and LGBT people as inferior, sees sex as an act, not of affection but domination, and which valorizes violence as the way to prove one’s self to the world. [...] Toxic masculinity aspires to toughness but is, in fact, an ideology of living in fear: The fear of ever seeming soft, tender, weak, or somehow less than manly. This insecurity is perhaps the most stalwart defining feature of toxic masculinity.
Yes, it's 'immature nerd revenge', but that's not even close to saying it's not toxic masculinity - nerd culture is steeped in a thick broth of toxic masculinity.

Daly's little fantasy is a classic example of toxic masculinity - he uses violence (not always realistic violence - the baleful polymorph counts) and threat of same to dominate those he feels wronged him, and adds a specifically sexual aspect to the domination of the women (PG, but still sexual), while denying his 'inferiors' (both male and female) the pleasure of sex. He displays no emotions but anger at being defied and satisfaction in the forced adulation he feels he deserves - he is the cold, calculating Alpha Dog in the world of his creation.

He doesn't negotiate, he dominates. He doesn't earn, he takes. He doesn't seduce, he forces. That is toxic masculinity in a nutshell.
#34
Old 12-31-2017, 08:12 AM
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I wasn't really impressed. As others have said too much reliance on the "sentient digital representation of a person" thing, it's been done too much. Even the best of them (Hang the DJ, probably as the best of a weak lot) is worse than everything in season 3 except "Men Against Fire".

Did I miss it or was there any actual establishment within the story whether the guy in "Black Museum" did it? His daughter and wife naturally insist he's innocent, he continued to claim it after death, but was never cleared. Of course guilty or not Rollo is still a sick villain for what he did to his "ghost".

Last edited by Mr Shine; 12-31-2017 at 08:13 AM.
#35
Old 12-31-2017, 08:58 AM
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I suppose it was necessary to keep the plot going but the idea that a DNA sample contains everything about a person up to an including today's memories gets a serious . The whole success of Nanette's plan also relied on far too much "how fucking dumb is Robert Daly?" to work.

Also the idea of someone willing to go to extreme lengths to avoid embarrassing pictures, subverted in Shut Up and Dance is back here and played straight.
#36
Old 12-31-2017, 09:21 AM
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No, I don't think it counts, not as that term is commonly applied. The character was simply a sadist, in a way that was unrelated to gender or sexuality.
...most people "commonly apply" toxic masculinity" incorrectly. IMHO it most certainly applies to the captain of the good ship Callister.
#37
Old 12-31-2017, 09:25 AM
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Anybody else catch the voice of the Infinity gamer at the end was Aaron Paul (Jessie Pinkman)? At least two Breaking Bad alums in the episode, counting “Todd”. Or, as I like to call him, “Fat Damon”.
#38
Old 12-31-2017, 09:40 AM
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Anybody else catch the voice of the Infinity gamer at the end was Aaron Paul (Jessie Pinkman)? At least two Breaking Bad alums in the episode, counting “Todd”. Or, as I like to call him, “Fat Damon”.
Yup. I also noticed the captain was fat matt damon, but didn't know he was in breaking bad.
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#39
Old 12-31-2017, 10:06 AM
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Anybody else catch the voice of the Infinity gamer at the end was Aaron Paul (Jessie Pinkman)? At least two Breaking Bad alums in the episode, counting “Todd”. Or, as I like to call him, “Fat Damon”.
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Yup. I also noticed the captain was fat matt damon, but didn't know he was in breaking bad.

I can’t help but wonder how this thread would be going if (a) Roberta Daly made simulations of co-workers to mistreat when their real-world counterparts did stuff like agree she should go with skim milk, since she could stand to lose a few pounds; and (b) we were referring to the actress as Pudgy Emma Stone.

“She took away my PENIS? Stealing my penis is a red fucking line.”
#40
Old 12-31-2017, 11:02 AM
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...most people "commonly apply" toxic masculinity" incorrectly. IMHO it most certainly applies to the captain of the good ship Callister.
Compare the (female) employees' reaction to the supposedly womanizing character who would "fuck a thrown ham sandwich before it hit the ground" but turns out to be genuinely liked, is devoted to his family (at least his kid), is not a creepy kidnapper/rapist, etc.
#41
Old 12-31-2017, 11:21 AM
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I suppose it was necessary to keep the plot going but the idea that a DNA sample contains everything about a person up to an including today's memories gets a serious .
I agree that this was a major weakness of that episode. For me to watch it to the end, I had to convince myself that DNA can magically store memories. Which isn't satisfying at all.

It would have worked better if Todd (sorry, Daly) had figured out a way to get into their brains without them knowing and then obtained enough information about them to simulate them digitally. Like, why not have them all log into Infinity for a work-related training, and while their bodies are all reclining and white-eyed, have Daly stick another disc on the heads that exports information rather than imports. He could use digital photos of their faces to create their avatars. Or maybe Infinity already has the faces figured out since they are employees and required to be in the database.

The problem with this is that they would never be able to defeat Daly without intentionally killing him. Because he'd always have that information stored somewhere--no doubt backed-up in the Cloud-- whereas the DNA is (conveniently) only kept in a mini-freezer. And I don't think nudie pictures would be enough to convince any decent protagonist to kill someone. So DNA it must be, I guess.

But I found the episode enjoyable because I liked the goofiness of it all. It cracked me up when they were talking to the "monster" from marketing like everything was totally normal. I liked how the coworkers fundamentally got along with each other and tried to make things work as much as they could, despite being in a truly shitty situation.
#42
Old 12-31-2017, 11:28 AM
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Best not to think too much about the DNA: once it's sequenced, and we see a machine doing just that, it's just digital information that can be stored and copied without reference to the original sample. I had the same reaction you did to it being a lame plot device that could be improved with a couple of minutes of writing.
#43
Old 12-31-2017, 11:47 AM
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Best not to think too much about the DNA: once it's sequenced, and we see a machine doing just that, it's just digital information that can be stored and copied without reference to the original sample. I had the same reaction you did to it being a lame plot device that could be improved with a couple of minutes of writing.

Plus, take it a step further: their plan wasn’t to leave him trapped (or else they wouldn’t bother raiding the mini-fridge), and wasn’t to survive (but they still cared about him using the contents of the fridge to create new duplicates).

But getting a discarded coffee cup was of course trivially easy for the guy; and, as far as I can tell, the Thought-They-Were-Doomed contingent didn’t leave behind helpful exposition to clue in their real-world counterparts.
#44
Old 12-31-2017, 11:57 AM
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To be fair to them, I think only one of them (the guy with the son) really cared about getting the DNA, specifically his son's. The "get the DNA" thing was thrown in there to convince him to get on board with the mutiny. The others just wanted to either "die" or just get away from Daly. So I would say they were largely successful in getting what they wanted. I know that if I had been in their shoes, I wouldn't have cared so much about subsequent versions of me being played with. I would only care about me.
#45
Old 12-31-2017, 12:01 PM
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Thanks for the heads up then. With that guidance it'll move down my queue. I'll finish Arkangel and then leave off for a bit.

Really though? They don't creatively come up with any other ideas than these few for how emerging technologies are going to ef us up? (Or minimally challenge our current ethical frameworks.)
Okay. Finished Arkangel. Much better and much more (thematically) than the heads up had me thinking it would be.

This is more what I was hoping for from the season - using the possible technologies to visit more classic human relationship themes, and they did it well. The lecture being on Oedipus, a classic version of parents trying to control the fate involving their children and more so of the consequences of being able to get answers to questions, the Arkangel system in this case serving the role of oracle: asking it for information to avoid tragedy causing tragedy to occur.

The blocking of unwanted information bit was used before but the ep was not about the technology.

Callister OTOH while cute, was more about having sentient avatars and how we would treat them. Many use "videogames" now to act out aggression and do so in ways they'd never do in the real world to real people - as the AI running the agents in these games develop emerging sentience (which we may not be aware of when or where to call it such, Turing test be damned) or even more our own sentiences cloned in a digital world ... but they did that exact exploration with a personal assistant agent theme already and best yet in the love story. If this came before those it would be one thing, but it didn't.
#46
Old 12-31-2017, 02:42 PM
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I just watched the first episode. I'm going to post my thoughts about it, but then won't venture back into this thread until I've seen the whole season, to avoid spoilers. (I think for this show in particular, it would be nice to have one thread per episode, but whatever...)

So, overall, I was disappointed. It was a neat premise, the acting and production values were great (I loved how deliberately 60s the spaceship effects were). But, several major problems:

(1) Plot/feasibility holes galore. That's not how DNA works. At all. I'd much rather have some technobabble where people get a brain scan before they can go into Infinity, and the bad guy has been illicitly copying them, or something like that. And it makes no sense that they are able to make a phone call to the real world, and instead of having the CEO guy call up the real life CEO guy and say "hey, it's me", they go with this overcomplicated blackmail scheme. And how does it make sense that the bad guy actually gets trapped and died? Who would ever put that device on their forehead if a code bug of some sort could literally trap and kill them forever?

(2) I feel like "someone cloned and trapped and suffering in someone else's VR is something they've already done a lot"

(3) I dislike how absolutely moustache-twirling evil the bad guy was. There's an interesting story to tell where he just wants to have star trek adventures, and wants the rest of the crew to play along, and then loses his temper, but really wants them to be his friend, yada yada. Instead he was just an asshole god, which made it less interesting.


So, overall, I'd say C-.
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#47
Old 12-31-2017, 03:44 PM
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Location: Wellington, New Zealand
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DPRK View Post
Compare the (female) employees' reaction to the supposedly womanizing character who would "fuck a thrown ham sandwich before it hit the ground" but turns out to be genuinely liked, is devoted to his family (at least his kid), is not a creepy kidnapper/rapist, etc.
...what does this have to do with what I said?
#48
Old 12-31-2017, 04:43 PM
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It was to affirm what you said: the "insecure nerd" stock character turns out to be a toxic asshole and worse, and the "womanizing boss" stock character turns out to be an appropriately(?) behaved, charismatic family man.

Despite this twist, I have to go along with the criticism laid out by MaxTheVool; the plot does not bear thinking about– they really should have tried a bit harder– and the story has been done before and more effectively.
#49
Old 12-31-2017, 05:53 PM
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A bizarre detail in ep. 1 is that there really was (or is) an "infinite procedurally-generated universe" prototype called Infinity in which you could fly through solar systems and land on planets. I wonder why the show used the name of a real game engine? Coincidence?

Last edited by DPRK; 12-31-2017 at 05:56 PM.
#50
Old 12-31-2017, 07:13 PM
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Join Date: Aug 2003
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Apparently the doctor story in S04E06 was written by Penn Jillette.
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